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The hacking of culture and the creation of socio-technical debt

schneier.com

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Re: The hacking of culture and the creation of socio-technical debt

#11

Post by dgfitz »

pessimizer wrote: post #8
AtlasBarfed wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the hints are in there, and I have my opinion. 1) Chinese Tiktok scaring the US government: Sure OUR corps can mentally rape our citizenry, but someone else? Nononononononono. This may provoke the first real debate on pernicious ubiquitous algorithmic manipulation. 2) Are we really out of "think of the children" political movements? With the polarity of Democratic and Republican parties changing, we may be ri…

[flagged]

> Then, after October 7th, when Tiktok accurately reflected the views of the younger half of the American public on Palestine

Probably 2/3rds of the younger half, at best.

Re: The hacking of culture and the creation of socio-technical debt

#12

Post by 082349872349872 »

janalsncm wrote: post #6

It is an interesting thought, what would the world look like if these global trends continue, if the role of the state continued to dissolve under the influence of multinational corporations. Perhaps Liberalism (individual rights/political equality) will turn out to be only a passing fad in 1000 years’ time. Corporatism allows transnational groups of people to coordinate in ways and at fidelities that have only recen…

See also The Space Merchants (1952)

Re: The hacking of culture and the creation of socio-technical debt

#13

Post by jimkleiber »

pessimizer wrote: post #8
AtlasBarfed wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the hints are in there, and I have my opinion. 1) Chinese Tiktok scaring the US government: Sure OUR corps can mentally rape our citizenry, but someone else? Nononononononono. This may provoke the first real debate on pernicious ubiquitous algorithmic manipulation. 2) Are we really out of "think of the children" political movements? With the polarity of Democratic and Republican parties changing, we may be ri…

[flagged]

Do you believe that governments might want to use social media platforms to try to divide the population within enemy countries?

Re: The hacking of culture and the creation of socio-technical debt

#14

Post by briantakita »

jimkleiber wrote: post #13
pessimizer wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Do you believe that governments might want to use social media platforms to try to divide the population within enemy countries?

Do you believe that governments might want to use social media platforms to try to divide the population within their own country?

Only saying this because it's how people in power legitimize their own power over everyone else. External boogie men help as well. Of course foreign influence is a real factor that works against people in their own country. The USA has done many foreign influence operations that has been detrimental to those people. I'm not surprised that foreign governments would do the same over here.

All in all, the general population often suffer downstream from these games of power.

Re: The hacking of culture and the creation of socio-technical debt

#15

Post by lmm »

jimkleiber wrote: post #13
pessimizer wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Do you believe that governments might want to use social media platforms to try to divide the population within enemy countries?

They can want all they like, doesn't mean they're going to be effective. Again, no-one cared until the arms dealers' incomes were threatened.

Re: The hacking of culture and the creation of socio-technical debt

#16

Post by eep_social »

082349872349872 wrote: post #12
janalsncm wrote: post #6

It is an interesting thought, what would the world look like if these global trends continue, if the role of the state continued to dissolve under the influence of multinational corporations. Perhaps Liberalism (individual rights/political equality) will turn out to be only a passing fad in 1000 years’ time. Corporatism allows transnational groups of people to coordinate in ways and at fidelities that have only recen…

See also The Space Merchants (1952)

And Snow Crash (1992)

Re: The hacking of culture and the creation of socio-technical debt

#17

Post by CMCDragonkai »

jimkleiber wrote: post #13
pessimizer wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Do you believe that governments might want to use social media platforms to try to divide the population within enemy countries?

This is interesting because it's like saying I would rather be oppressed by my government than by foreign governments. But if that's true for you, why is not true for the citizens of other countries? Taking this to the logical conclusion, all foreign influence should be prevented for being potentially destructive and all the history's isolationism would be justified.

Re: The hacking of culture and the creation of socio-technical debt

#18

Post by yimmothathird »

janalsncm wrote: post #6

It is an interesting thought, what would the world look like if these global trends continue, if the role of the state continued to dissolve under the influence of multinational corporations. Perhaps Liberalism (individual rights/political equality) will turn out to be only a passing fad in 1000 years’ time. Corporatism allows transnational groups of people to coordinate in ways and at fidelities that have only recen…

[dead]

Re: The hacking of culture and the creation of socio-technical debt

#19

Post by Mathnerd314 »

I disagree with most of the examples. When newspapers are struggling, for example - it is just that, a struggle. It is not "socio-technical debt". Newspapers in 1830 sold maybe 148 million copies annually, 0.4 million per day. Comparing that to the Census number of 12,860,702, we see that only 3% of people read the newspaper. In contrast daily newspaper readership today (print+digital) is 20.9 million, compared to 333.3 million population, 6.3% of people. Whatever social function newspapers serve, it is clear that they are still serving it. Actually, technical debt is when you don't replace old, crunky stuff - arguably, if traditional news stories make up only 3 percent of social media content, then the social media companies should be figuring out how to refactor their platforms so as to be able to completely replace these old, legacy businesses.

Re: The hacking of culture and the creation of socio-technical debt

#20

Post by ipv6ipv4 »

Mathnerd314 wrote: post #19

I disagree with most of the examples. When newspapers are struggling, for example - it is just that, a struggle. It is not "socio-technical debt". Newspapers in 1830 sold maybe 148 million copies annually, 0.4 million per day. Comparing that to the Census number of 12,860,702, we see that only 3% of people read the newspaper. In contrast daily newspaper readership today (print+digital) is 20.9 million, compared to 33…

In 1830, I believe most papers were weekly. So your percentage is missing a multiplier that could be fairly substantial.

And by 1850 the number of newspapers (still mostly weeklies) nearly tripled with an annual circulation of 500 million.

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