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Democracy Dies Behind Paywalls

theatlantic.com

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Re: Democracy Dies Behind Paywalls

#11

Post by whywhywhywhy »

daymanstep wrote: post #10
strict9 wrote: post #7

It also dies behind dark patterns that prevent you from canceling the subscription. I've subscribed to a few publications over the years but not any more. After getting burned a few times from an easy to sign up but impossible to cancel user experience I have sworn them all off. I refuse to support subscriptions that require talking to a person. And waiting on hold and having to navigate the operator trying to preven…

Why not just use a virtual credit card?

Why not just read something else that doesn't require such hoops.

Re: Democracy Dies Behind Paywalls

#12

Post by flutas »

daymanstep wrote: post #10
strict9 wrote: post #7

It also dies behind dark patterns that prevent you from canceling the subscription. I've subscribed to a few publications over the years but not any more. After getting burned a few times from an easy to sign up but impossible to cancel user experience I have sworn them all off. I refuse to support subscriptions that require talking to a person. And waiting on hold and having to navigate the operator trying to preven…

Why not just use a virtual credit card?

They can still send you to a debt collector if you don't "properly" cancel by sending them a smoke signal at 3:42pm on a sunny day with easterly winds.

They did it to me, luckily I was able to get it removed.

Re: Democracy Dies Behind Paywalls

#13

Post by gustavus »

strict9 wrote: post #7

It also dies behind dark patterns that prevent you from canceling the subscription. I've subscribed to a few publications over the years but not any more. After getting burned a few times from an easy to sign up but impossible to cancel user experience I have sworn them all off. I refuse to support subscriptions that require talking to a person. And waiting on hold and having to navigate the operator trying to preven…

Once signed up for the WSJ. Took 10 minutes just put in my credit card and address, got a sign up discount, and boom was done.

3 months later I needed to cancel. It turns out you can only cancel by a phone call, during their business hours on the east coast. Of course that wasn't the end because then it was probably twenty minutes on hold and fighting with. "No I want to cancel. No I don't care if you offer me a discount, I am pissed you made me call in to cancel. No I don't want to suspend I want to quit."

Swore I would never purchase them again if they are going to do something like that.

Re: Democracy Dies Behind Paywalls

#14

Post by macintux »

hunglee2 wrote: post #2

An interesting dilemma for media owners - the subscription model is the future of news, yet the self suppression of reach that this necessarily entails means that media owners now have far less influence over politics than they did during the ad-funded era, hence this unsatisfactory half-way house of 'its free when we want to influence your voting behaviour' Also: democracy isn't dying just because media stops have t…

> People will still vote, that is not being suppressed

Some would vehemently disagree with the second part of that sentence. Voter suppression is practically a plank of one of the two U.S. major parties.

And is voting still meaningful if most people are ignorant of what's happening in the shadows?

Re: Democracy Dies Behind Paywalls

#15

Post by hunglee2 »

macintux wrote: post #14
hunglee2 wrote: post #2

An interesting dilemma for media owners - the subscription model is the future of news, yet the self suppression of reach that this necessarily entails means that media owners now have far less influence over politics than they did during the ad-funded era, hence this unsatisfactory half-way house of 'its free when we want to influence your voting behaviour' Also: democracy isn't dying just because media stops have t…

> People will still vote, that is not being suppressed Some would vehemently disagree with the second part of that sentence. Voter suppression is practically a plank of one of the two U.S. major parties. And is voting still meaningful if most people are ignorant of what's happening in the shadows?

how is voter suppression operating (genuine question!) - what are the key techniques?

>And is voting still meaningful if most people are ignorant of what's happening in the shadows?Democracy is simply people voting for representatives, we have never measured ignorance of the population, hence no qualitative difference today than any time in the history of this system of governance

Re: Democracy Dies Behind Paywalls

#16

Post by adgjlsfhk1 »

hunglee2 wrote: post #15
macintux wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People will still vote, that is not being suppressed Some would vehemently disagree with the second part of that sentence. Voter suppression is practically a plank of one of the two U.S. major parties. And is voting still meaningful if most people are ignorant of what's happening in the shadows?

how is voter suppression operating (genuine question!) - what are the key techniques? >And is voting still meaningful if most people are ignorant of what's happening in the shadows? Democracy is simply people voting for representatives, we have never measured ignorance of the population, hence no qualitative difference today than any time in the history of this system of governance

the most obvious is by closing poling places in regions where your opponents live. Lots of Republican states have dramatically reduced the number of poling places in cities leading, predictably to hour long lines to vote. in addition, some have made giving food or water to people in line illegal.

Re: Democracy Dies Behind Paywalls

#17

Post by macintux »

hunglee2 wrote: post #15
macintux wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People will still vote, that is not being suppressed Some would vehemently disagree with the second part of that sentence. Voter suppression is practically a plank of one of the two U.S. major parties. And is voting still meaningful if most people are ignorant of what's happening in the shadows?

how is voter suppression operating (genuine question!) - what are the key techniques? >And is voting still meaningful if most people are ignorant of what's happening in the shadows? Democracy is simply people voting for representatives, we have never measured ignorance of the population, hence no qualitative difference today than any time in the history of this system of governance

> how is voter suppression operating

Well, one egregious example would be sending a SWAT team to arrest someone in the early morning because they were erroneously allowed to register but not to vote.

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2022/08/florida-voter-fr...

Or aggressively purging voter rolls in minority districts.

https://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/lawsuit-alleges-ohio-illegally-p...

Or closing voting sites in minority areas.

https://www.cnn.com/2022/01/19/politics/poll-closures-rural-...

Or outlawing handing out water to people waiting in line to vote.

https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2021/mar/29/josh-holme...

And early/absentee voting has been on the firing line.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/interactive/2021/vot...

Re: Democracy Dies Behind Paywalls

#18

Post by hunglee2 »

adgjlsfhk1 wrote: post #16
hunglee2 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

how is voter suppression operating (genuine question!) - what are the key techniques? >And is voting still meaningful if most people are ignorant of what's happening in the shadows? Democracy is simply people voting for representatives, we have never measured ignorance of the population, hence no qualitative difference today than any time in the history of this system of governance

the most obvious is by closing poling places in regions where your opponents live. Lots of Republican states have dramatically reduced the number of poling places in cities leading, predictably to hour long lines to vote. in addition, some have made giving food or water to people in line illegal.

this is terrible. How are they able to get away with this?

Re: Democracy Dies Behind Paywalls

#19

Post by MrDrMcCoy »

flutas wrote: post #12
daymanstep wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why not just use a virtual credit card?

They can still send you to a debt collector if you don't "properly" cancel by sending them a smoke signal at 3:42pm on a sunny day with easterly winds. They did it to me, luckily I was able to get it removed.

Not if you never give them any real information about you. At least one virtual card operator lets you use whatever name and address you want per card.

Re: Democracy Dies Behind Paywalls

#20

Post by hunglee2 »

macintux wrote: post #17
hunglee2 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

how is voter suppression operating (genuine question!) - what are the key techniques? >And is voting still meaningful if most people are ignorant of what's happening in the shadows? Democracy is simply people voting for representatives, we have never measured ignorance of the population, hence no qualitative difference today than any time in the history of this system of governance

> how is voter suppression operating Well, one egregious example would be sending a SWAT team to arrest someone in the early morning because they were erroneously allowed to register but not to vote. https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2022/08/florida-voter-fr... Or aggressively purging voter rolls in minority districts. https://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/lawsuit-alleges-ohio-illegally-p... Or closing voting sites in minori…

thanks. This is outrageous. How is it possible for these actions to occur, especially closing voting sites? Surely there should be federal mandate that there should be X number of voting sites per Y number of residents
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