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The U.S. National Debt is Rising by $1T About Every 100 Days

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Re: The U.S. National Debt is Rising by $1T About Every 100 Days

#11

Post by EchoChamberMan »

2OEH8eoCRo0 wrote: post #10
EchoChamberMan wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The rich are getting richer, for sure. https://www.victorpest.com/articles/what-humans-can-learn-fr...

I understand that. So am I. I just don't follow what that has to do with my concerns.

We can perform a thought experiment.

You say you're getting richer. I'm getting poorer.

Want to give me some money to balance things out?

Probably not.

The rich don't care about the outcome for the rest of us. They're building bunkers. You should do the same if you can. Sam Altman, or Sama, as people affectionately call him, has guns, anti-biotics, etc. stockpiled in a remote bunker where he can survive the collapse of society.

Re: The U.S. National Debt is Rising by $1T About Every 100 Days

#12

Post by boppo1 »

2OEH8eoCRo0 wrote: post #7
EchoChamberMan wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The wealth is concentrated in the hands of the very few. [Edit] And they have no interest in sharing, or paying off government debts.

Are you trying to say that the US economy isn't actually thriving right now?

He’s not. I am. The wealth of a nation is the goods and services available to its common people. We’ve shifted a lot of economic measures so that we’re really just paying attention to the value of assets as opposed to what they represent.

An example: In early February, retail sales numbers came in strong. The stock market went down. Why? Because analysts know that strong retail means a lower likelihood of our central monetary planners lowering interest rates, and lower rates mathematically cause asset values to grow because you’re making the denominator smaller.

Stocks should not thrive on denominator changes, but on a growing numerator: earnings. Earnings reflect actual economic activity.

But most people have their economics education provided by this regime and think it’s totally fine for the market to be determined by interest rates instead of productivity.

Re: The U.S. National Debt is Rising by $1T About Every 100 Days

#14

Post by justonenote »

2OEH8eoCRo0 wrote: post #10
EchoChamberMan wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The rich are getting richer, for sure. https://www.victorpest.com/articles/what-humans-can-learn-fr...

I understand that. So am I. I just don't follow what that has to do with my concerns.

You may be getting richer in dollar denominated value, and you may even be getting richer in purchasing power for assets right now, but if asset prices (say housing) are increasing 10%-15% year on year can you maintain that 'getting richer'?

Also from the sounds of it, and the fact you are both on HN and doing well in the market right now, implies you are in a pretty good position, compared to the general population.

To answer your question more directly, the market is doing well because both the metrics and mechanics of markets are heavily heavily gamed. The 1 trillion dollars that is being added to the US debt is going _somewhere_. You happen to be getting a piece of it which you think is great (understandably), but you can be assured that there are many people above you in the chain getting much bigger pieces, and people lower in the chain getting less and less.

A dog hanging around the table of warlords will be a lot better fed than the dogs whos owners just got their harvest taken from them.

Re: The U.S. National Debt is Rising by $1T About Every 100 Days

#15

Post by trafficante »

When the Democrats hold power, this crisis will be exploited to enact heavy taxes on 401ks and the like (recent think tank white papers are creating ground work for this).

When the Republicans hold power, this crisis will be exploited to cut Social Security for Gen X and younger and take an axe to other entitlement programs.

Re: The U.S. National Debt is Rising by $1T About Every 100 Days

#16

Post by 2OEH8eoCRo0 »

justonenote wrote: post #14
2OEH8eoCRo0 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I understand that. So am I. I just don't follow what that has to do with my concerns.

You may be getting richer in dollar denominated value, and you may even be getting richer in purchasing power for assets right now, but if asset prices (say housing) are increasing 10%-15% year on year can you maintain that 'getting richer'? Also from the sounds of it, and the fact you are both on HN and doing well in the market right now, implies you are in a pretty good position, compared to the general population.…

> you can be assured that there are many people above you in the chain getting much bigger pieces

This bothers a lot of people but it doesn't bother me. I see it so often that it feels like a flamebait tactic to elicit envy.

Re: The U.S. National Debt is Rising by $1T About Every 100 Days

#17

Post by SkyPuncher »

2OEH8eoCRo0 wrote: post #3

I can't square the incredible performance of the market and health of the US economy with the deficit. If times are so good then why aren't we taking advantage of the opportunity to pay down some debt or get control of our deficit? I don't even want to think about what happens in a crisis.

Because this debt is largely meaningless - except as a political tool. All countries have debt to the point that it’s basically a big web.

What really matters is the trust in the financial system behind the debt. Do other countries believe that the US can take out more debt in good faith? If yes, then this is fine.

In individual terms, this is much like having a mortgage. It’s a massive number, much larger than your annual income that you’ll be making payments on for ages. You can still get more debt (credit cards, auto loans, HELOC) because it’s expected that you’ll have a certain amount of debt. Your debt only becomes a problem when you show that you can’t pay it.

Re: The U.S. National Debt is Rising by $1T About Every 100 Days

#19

Post by silverquiet »

2OEH8eoCRo0 wrote: post #16
justonenote wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You may be getting richer in dollar denominated value, and you may even be getting richer in purchasing power for assets right now, but if asset prices (say housing) are increasing 10%-15% year on year can you maintain that 'getting richer'? Also from the sounds of it, and the fact you are both on HN and doing well in the market right now, implies you are in a pretty good position, compared to the general population.…

> you can be assured that there are many people above you in the chain getting much bigger pieces This bothers a lot of people but it doesn't bother me. I see it so often that it feels like a flamebait tactic to elicit envy.

Are there any wealth redistribution efforts that bother you? Like perhaps student debt forgiveness? Or welfare for single mothers?

Re: The U.S. National Debt is Rising by $1T About Every 100 Days

#20

Post by dnissley »

SkyPuncher wrote: post #17
2OEH8eoCRo0 wrote: post #3

I can't square the incredible performance of the market and health of the US economy with the deficit. If times are so good then why aren't we taking advantage of the opportunity to pay down some debt or get control of our deficit? I don't even want to think about what happens in a crisis.

Because this debt is largely meaningless - except as a political tool. All countries have debt to the point that it’s basically a big web. What really matters is the trust in the financial system behind the debt. Do other countries believe that the US can take out more debt in good faith? If yes, then this is fine. In individual terms, this is much like having a mortgage. It’s a massive number, much larger than your…

If that's the case doesn't it still make sense to try and reduce debt? Due to unforeseen circumstances? Going by your metaphor we could say the possibility of the industry you work in becoming a lot less lucrative due to technological advances, or macroeconomic changes like jobs going overseas -- this isn't an abstract threat! It's happened before and will happen again!
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