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Israel's economy shrinks more than expected on Gaza war

bbc.com

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Re: Israel's economy shrinks more than expected on Gaza war

#11

Post by jstarfish »

bsaul wrote: post #9
majikaja wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the international community has become numb to the issue of the hostages due to the civilian death toll on the other side being so high

[flagged]

Not one single person forgot what triggered it. Most people who aren't bots or shills just disagree that this is at all an appropriate response.

Killing civilians in retaliation is not war and no amount of rabbinic rhetoric makes it right. Find a diplomatic solution.

It's almost like Israel [leadership] wants another generation of people to hate the Jews.

But what do I know of persecution; I'm just a gypsy. Everybody loves when my people come around.

Re: Israel's economy shrinks more than expected on Gaza war

#12

Post by tptacek »

jstarfish wrote: post #11
bsaul wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Not one single person forgot what triggered it. Most people who aren't bots or shills just disagree that this is at all an appropriate response. Killing civilians in retaliation is not war and no amount of rabbinic rhetoric makes it right. Find a diplomatic solution. It's almost like Israel [leadership] wants another generation of people to hate the Jews. But what do I know of persecution; I'm just a gypsy. Everybody…

"Rabbinic rhetoric"?

Re: Israel's economy shrinks more than expected on Gaza war

#13

Post by hypeit »

tptacek wrote: post #12
jstarfish wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not one single person forgot what triggered it. Most people who aren't bots or shills just disagree that this is at all an appropriate response. Killing civilians in retaliation is not war and no amount of rabbinic rhetoric makes it right. Find a diplomatic solution. It's almost like Israel [leadership] wants another generation of people to hate the Jews. But what do I know of persecution; I'm just a gypsy. Everybody…

"Rabbinic rhetoric"?

Things like calling the Palestinians “amalek”, carving the Star of David into a playground with bulldozers, IDF soldiers taking about fulfilling prophecy…

Re: Israel's economy shrinks more than expected on Gaza war

#14

Post by kasey_junk »

hypeit wrote: post #10
bsaul wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

I don’t think anyone forgot. A lot of people think Israel caused this with Nakba and their actions since then. I don’t want to start a flamewar, I just don’t think people forgot, they’re just not on Israel’s side.

[flagged]

Re: Israel's economy shrinks more than expected on Gaza war

#15

Post by tptacek »

hypeit wrote: post #13
tptacek wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Rabbinic rhetoric"?

Things like calling the Palestinians “amalek”, carving the Star of David into a playground with bulldozers, IDF soldiers taking about fulfilling prophecy…

If the claim is that militant Israelis are using religious rhetoric to justify their actions, that seems uncontroversial (though the "Amalek" thing is a misquote, and refers not to Palestinians but to Hamas itself). If instead the idea is that the "rhetoric" of "rabbis" is somehow automatically dehumanizing to Palestinians, that seems like a problematic claim.

Re: Israel's economy shrinks more than expected on Gaza war

#16

Post by hypeit »

kasey_junk wrote: post #14
hypeit wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t think anyone forgot. A lot of people think Israel caused this with Nakba and their actions since then. I don’t want to start a flamewar, I just don’t think people forgot, they’re just not on Israel’s side.

[flagged]

I don’t believe there was any sexual assault. There’s precedent for this type of armed resistance. The Haitian Slave Revolt and the Pueblo Revolt are both very similar. I think Oct 7th was justified, I don’t want to litigate it here though. This will be my last comment, I just want to state what a lot of people are thinking so it’s not misrepresented. I know many people here won’t agree.

Re: Israel's economy shrinks more than expected on Gaza war

#17

Post by enterprise_cog »

tptacek wrote: post #15
hypeit wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Things like calling the Palestinians “amalek”, carving the Star of David into a playground with bulldozers, IDF soldiers taking about fulfilling prophecy…

If the claim is that militant Israelis are using religious rhetoric to justify their actions, that seems uncontroversial (though the "Amalek" thing is a misquote, and refers not to Palestinians but to Hamas itself). If instead the idea is that the "rhetoric" of "rabbis" is somehow automatically dehumanizing to Palestinians, that seems like a problematic claim.

You might want to let the IDF know then, cause they have taken the Amalek quote quite literally.

“‘I will punish the Amalekites for what they did to Israel when they waylaid them as they came up from Egypt. Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.’”

Re: Israel's economy shrinks more than expected on Gaza war

#18

Post by enterprise_cog »

jstarfish wrote: post #11
bsaul wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Not one single person forgot what triggered it. Most people who aren't bots or shills just disagree that this is at all an appropriate response. Killing civilians in retaliation is not war and no amount of rabbinic rhetoric makes it right. Find a diplomatic solution. It's almost like Israel [leadership] wants another generation of people to hate the Jews. But what do I know of persecution; I'm just a gypsy. Everybody…

Zionists benefit from antisemitism. It furthers the idea that Jews are only safe in Israel. It’s part of the reason they call everything antisemitism, it scares the diaspora and justifies the existence of Israel.

Re: Israel's economy shrinks more than expected on Gaza war

#19

Post by tptacek »

enterprise_cog wrote: post #17
tptacek wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the claim is that militant Israelis are using religious rhetoric to justify their actions, that seems uncontroversial (though the "Amalek" thing is a misquote, and refers not to Palestinians but to Hamas itself). If instead the idea is that the "rhetoric" of "rabbis" is somehow automatically dehumanizing to Palestinians, that seems like a problematic claim.

You might want to let the IDF know then, cause they have taken the Amalek quote quite literally. “‘I will punish the Amalekites for what they did to Israel when they waylaid them as they came up from Egypt. Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.’”

Once again: that quote refers to Hamas, not the Palestinian people.

I am not disputing that it represents religious rhetoric used to justify IDF actions. I'm only pushing back on the notion that it refers broadly to Palestinians.

Re: Israel's economy shrinks more than expected on Gaza war

#20

Post by defrost »

tptacek wrote: post #15
hypeit wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Things like calling the Palestinians “amalek”, carving the Star of David into a playground with bulldozers, IDF soldiers taking about fulfilling prophecy…

If the claim is that militant Israelis are using religious rhetoric to justify their actions, that seems uncontroversial (though the "Amalek" thing is a misquote, and refers not to Palestinians but to Hamas itself). If instead the idea is that the "rhetoric" of "rabbis" is somehow automatically dehumanizing to Palestinians, that seems like a problematic claim.

For my part I find the implication that the rhetoric of rabbis is homogenous and aligned to be most problematic.

There are those that appear to fully back Netanyahu and his longstanding views on treatment of the Palestinian state, there are others who are loudly against the actions of the Israeli state in recent years.

( I'd remark that there are more than two extremes but feel this is not the right thread to comment about rabbis on a spectrum )

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