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A new solution for the "reverse sprinkler" problem

arstechnica.com

11–19 of 19 posts

Re: A new solution for the "reverse sprinkler" problem

#11

Doesn't this boil down to time-reversal? I doubt CPT symmetry is relevant here, so I'd be very surprised if it didn't simply reverse the rotation.

The rotation is not reversed though (at least not with the same speed), that's why it's always been interesting.

Re: A new solution for the "reverse sprinkler" problem

#12
post #7

I've googled for about 5 minutes trying to understand ....is the "reverse sprinkler" just a device that has been impossible to build so it was a strictly theoretical problem? "We found that the reverse sprinkler spins in the ‘reverse’ or opposite direction when taking in water" - really, this was that impossible to build that nobody knew what it would do? weird

It's a sprinkler with the pumps pulling water in instead of pushing it out.

Plenty of people built one since Feynman stated the problem, it simply doesn't rotate or rotates very weekly on the same direction a normal sprinkler would. A lot of people think this is anti-intuitive.

Re: A new solution for the "reverse sprinkler" problem

#13

Doesn't this boil down to time-reversal? I doubt CPT symmetry is relevant here, so I'd be very surprised if it didn't simply reverse the rotation.

A normal sprinkler works by a pump pushing water out the nozzle. Wouldn't a time reversed sprinkler be a situation where water is flying into the sprinkler and depressing the pump? in that case I would expect the rotation to be reversed.

Re: A new solution for the "reverse sprinkler" problem

#14

Doesn't this boil down to time-reversal? I doubt CPT symmetry is relevant here, so I'd be very surprised if it didn't simply reverse the rotation.

No. A nozzle behaves differently if you plug it the other way around, and that does not break CPT symmetry.

Re: A new solution for the "reverse sprinkler" problem

#16
post #7

I've googled for about 5 minutes trying to understand ....is the "reverse sprinkler" just a device that has been impossible to build so it was a strictly theoretical problem? "We found that the reverse sprinkler spins in the ‘reverse’ or opposite direction when taking in water" - really, this was that impossible to build that nobody knew what it would do? weird

From stories I’ve read, I think people generally, and including Feynman, concluded that the sprinkler would not rotate. Because conservation of angular momentum. Which is almost true. So what’s fun is that this experiment shows it’s not entirely true, if you have a sensitive enough experiment that takes into account more nuance of the fluid dynamics.

Re: A new solution for the "reverse sprinkler" problem

#18

Doesn't this boil down to time-reversal? I doubt CPT symmetry is relevant here, so I'd be very surprised if it didn't simply reverse the rotation.

A normal sprinkler works by a pump pushing water out the nozzle. Wouldn't a time reversed sprinkler be a situation where water is flying into the sprinkler and depressing the pump? in that case I would expect the rotation to be reversed.

Well, yes. Isn’t that the situation the article is describing? Suction isn’t a real thing, so-

Wait. Is this meant to imply it’s running underwater?

Re: A new solution for the "reverse sprinkler" problem

#19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A normal sprinkler works by a pump pushing water out the nozzle. Wouldn't a time reversed sprinkler be a situation where water is flying into the sprinkler and depressing the pump? in that case I would expect the rotation to be reversed.

Well, yes. Isn’t that the situation the article is describing? Suction isn’t a real thing, so- Wait. Is this meant to imply it’s running underwater?

Yes, in the thought experiment it runs underwater. It's fine though because it can run underwater in both cases, so that doesn't ruin the symmetry.

The article implies a situation where the pump is running in the opposite direction as normal, sucking the water in. That's not time-reversed though (eg in the time reversed version, the pump generates electricity instead of consuming it, because the water is pushing it instead of it pushing the water)

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