Will an IBM computer be your next mayor? • Hacker News Board

Re: Will an IBM computer be your next mayor?

#11

Post by metatronscube » Fri, Apr 27, 2012, 2:31 PM UTC

mseebach wrote: post #9

metatronscube wrote: post #6

I think its worth exploring this concept. I wouldn't mind living under an AI controlled meritocracy ;). I don't care if an AI or a person is running a city as long as they are good at their job and they make sensible balanced decisions that are in the best interest of the people. If that's a machine intelligence then so be it, I for one welcome our IBM supercomputer super controller overlords.

> as long as they are good[X] at their job[X] and they make sensible[X] balanced[X] decisions that are in the best interest[X] of the people[X] Please objectively and exhaustively define the marked terms. That, not AI, is the real challenge to better government. Incidentally, it's also pretty much the definition of politics.

Erm...No :)

Well ok, I get what you are saying, but a machine intelligence would faithfully and honestly apply these perfect values every time without bias. When have you ever known a flesh and blood Government to do so?

Re: Will an IBM computer be your next mayor?

#12

Post by mseebach » Fri, Apr 27, 2012, 3:21 PM UTC

metatronscube wrote: post #11

mseebach wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> as long as they are good[X] at their job[X] and they make sensible[X] balanced[X] decisions that are in the best interest[X] of the people[X] Please objectively and exhaustively define the marked terms. That, not AI, is the real challenge to better government. Incidentally, it's also pretty much the definition of politics.

Erm...No :) Well ok, I get what you are saying, but a machine intelligence would faithfully and honestly apply these perfect values every time without bias. When have you ever known a flesh and blood Government to do so?

My point is that you can't establish criteria that will predetermine your response to a given situation unless you subscribe to an extremely simplistic ideology. Politicians with these ideologies don't generally get elected for executive office - and it's NOT out of fear they won't faithfully and honestly apply their ideology, rather the opposite - so why would an algorithm?

Re: Will an IBM computer be your next mayor?

#13

Post by drcube » Fri, Apr 27, 2012, 3:25 PM UTC

The government will still run the city. The good ones have always stayed out of the implementation details, because they are no good at it. That's why we have a permanent bureaucracy of full-time unelected government employees, as well as civilian contractors.

Do Ford and GM run cities now, since they implement everything from police cruisers to garbage trucks? Do plumbers and engineers run the city because they implement the details of the sewer system and running water?

Re: Will an IBM computer be your next mayor?

#14

Post by drcube » Fri, Apr 27, 2012, 3:33 PM UTC

mseebach wrote: post #12

metatronscube wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Erm...No :) Well ok, I get what you are saying, but a machine intelligence would faithfully and honestly apply these perfect values every time without bias. When have you ever known a flesh and blood Government to do so?

My point is that you can't establish criteria that will predetermine your response to a given situation unless you subscribe to an extremely simplistic ideology. Politicians with these ideologies don't generally get elected for executive office - and it's NOT out of fear they won't faithfully and honestly apply their ideology, rather the opposite - so why would an algorithm?

>...unless you subscribe to an extremely simplistic ideology. Politicians with these ideologies don't generally get elected...

Only politicians with simplistic ideologies get elected. What world have you been living in? "Soundbite philosophy" is a big part of why our governments are so terrible at their jobs. Nuance and subtlety don't earn you votes.

Re: Will an IBM computer be your next mayor?

#15

Post by mseebach » Fri, Apr 27, 2012, 3:55 PM UTC

drcube wrote: post #14

mseebach wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My point is that you can't establish criteria that will predetermine your response to a given situation unless you subscribe to an extremely simplistic ideology. Politicians with these ideologies don't generally get elected for executive office - and it's NOT out of fear they won't faithfully and honestly apply their ideology, rather the opposite - so why would an algorithm?

>...unless you subscribe to an extremely simplistic ideology. Politicians with these ideologies don't generally get elected... Only politicians with simplistic ideologies get elected. What world have you been living in? "Soundbite philosophy" is a big part of why our governments are so terrible at their jobs. Nuance and subtlety don't earn you votes.

No, they run on simplistic renderings of whatever issues are fashionable whenever they run. Most have no discernible consistent ideology at all, and are elected on vague metrics such as "good leader" and "likeable".

Re: Will an IBM computer be your next mayor?

#16

Post by khafra » Fri, Apr 27, 2012, 6:15 PM UTC

mseebach wrote: post #9

metatronscube wrote: post #6

I think its worth exploring this concept. I wouldn't mind living under an AI controlled meritocracy ;). I don't care if an AI or a person is running a city as long as they are good at their job and they make sensible balanced decisions that are in the best interest of the people. If that's a machine intelligence then so be it, I for one welcome our IBM supercomputer super controller overlords.

> as long as they are good[X] at their job[X] and they make sensible[X] balanced[X] decisions that are in the best interest[X] of the people[X] Please objectively and exhaustively define the marked terms. That, not AI, is the real challenge to better government. Incidentally, it's also pretty much the definition of politics.

> Please objectively and exhaustively define the marked terms.

CEV[1]! ...maybe.

[1] http://singinst.org/upload/CEV.html