Tesla should leave the market and let Swedes buy automobiles from their own brands... like... err... Saab which no longer exists... or Volvo, which now belongs to a Chinese conglomerate...
Polestars are pretty nice!
Swedish court rules against Tesla in dispute with postal service over deliveries
11–20 of 409 posts
Re: Swedish court rules against Tesla in dispute with postal service over deliveries
#12> "The district court has decided that PostNord should not be forced make deliveries to Tesla before the case is closed," the Solna district court said in a statement.
Just another interim decision, apparently.
Re: Swedish court rules against Tesla in dispute with postal service over deliveries
#13Earlier quoted context omitted.
According to Tesla, the agreement which employees have in Sweden is already better than the minimum bar set by union, so Teslas issues appears to more out of principle than out of actual issues with the agreement itself. Or Tesla is lying and the agreement with employees is not actually better.
Both parties act out of principles. The conflict is about power dynamics, first and foremost.
Yup, and one is the principles of a large car company from another country while the other is the social underpinnings of the countries entire labour market going back a century
Re: Swedish court rules against Tesla in dispute with postal service over deliveries
#14Small differences in labor law make all the difference. In Finland, Tesla repair shops follow the minimums stated in collective agreements and Musk probably don't even know about it. In Sweden it's issue for him. Finland has generally applicable collective agreements where employers should observe at least the provisions of a national collective agreement considered representative in the relevant sector. When a colle…
According to Tesla, the agreement which employees have in Sweden is already better than the minimum bar set by union, so Teslas issues appears to more out of principle than out of actual issues with the agreement itself. Or Tesla is lying and the agreement with employees is not actually better.
Somehow I'd bet a large amount of money that Tesla is lying, considering that's what Elon is best at.
Re: Swedish court rules against Tesla in dispute with postal service over deliveries
#15Tesla should leave the market and let Swedes buy automobiles from their own brands... like... err... Saab which no longer exists... or Volvo, which now belongs to a Chinese conglomerate...
If Tesla leave Sweden, we will still have many many brands to pick from. Here in Sweden we can buy cars from other companies.
A Tesla car is pretty much off the shopping list for me, due to Elon's behavior
Re: Swedish court rules against Tesla in dispute with postal service over deliveries
#16Is PostNord like the post office or like fedex? If the former, that seems crazy to me. Imagine the post office just refused to deliver your electricity bill despite the electric company paying for a stamp. If it's the latter it makes a lot more sense.
Both, unlike in the US the Swedish post office is privatized and handled by multiple companies, eg Citymail also offers postal services.
PostNord has won the tender with the Swedish transport authority though and as such is the one they should use.
PostNord is the result of the merger between the privatized (but state owned) Swedish and Danish postal services.
But also – union rights and postal rights needs to be weighed against each other here – both are important
Re: Swedish court rules against Tesla in dispute with postal service over deliveries
#17Small differences in labor law make all the difference. In Finland, Tesla repair shops follow the minimums stated in collective agreements and Musk probably don't even know about it. In Sweden it's issue for him. Finland has generally applicable collective agreements where employers should observe at least the provisions of a national collective agreement considered representative in the relevant sector. When a colle…
According to Tesla, the agreement which employees have in Sweden is already better than the minimum bar set by union, so Teslas issues appears to more out of principle than out of actual issues with the agreement itself. Or Tesla is lying and the agreement with employees is not actually better.
I’ve heard some form of this from every company fighting unions. If that’s really the case, wouldn’t it be beneficial to the finances of the company overall if the union is requesting less benefits?
Re: Swedish court rules against Tesla in dispute with postal service over deliveries
#18Small differences in labor law make all the difference. In Finland, Tesla repair shops follow the minimums stated in collective agreements and Musk probably don't even know about it. In Sweden it's issue for him. Finland has generally applicable collective agreements where employers should observe at least the provisions of a national collective agreement considered representative in the relevant sector. When a colle…
At this point the famed Swedish model shows its limits, IMHO.
> "It's about the Swedish collective agreement model, and there is a consensus on it, both politically and between the parties in the labour market, Seko's president Gabriella Lavecchia told Reuters by email.
And yet this is not a legal obligation, as far as I understand, and Tesla is acting lawfully. So the model seems to be that there are unwritten rules and that the whole country is allowed to club you into submission if you don't follow them.
At this point it seems that at least some form of legal obligation (you give an example) would clarify what is understood to be compulsory... Transparent rule of law is also a model for a good reason.
From the outside it's a little odd (at least to me) that the Swedes seem adamant that Tesla must accept a collective agreement and also that there is no need to make that the law. That's the peculiarity, IMHO.
Re: Swedish court rules against Tesla in dispute with postal service over deliveries
#19Is PostNord like the post office or like fedex? If the former, that seems crazy to me. Imagine the post office just refused to deliver your electricity bill despite the electric company paying for a stamp. If it's the latter it makes a lot more sense.
They are the national postal service, successor to the old Posten AB (which just means “The Post, Ltd”), and before that Postverket (“The Post Agency”). There is nothing strange about the notion of a postal strike, that's why the US has the USPS to begin with (its predecessor's employees went on strike and brought the US federal govt to its knees).
> There is nothing strange about the notion of a postal strike, that's why the US has the USPS to begin with (its predecessor's employees went on strike and brought the US federal govt to its knees).
Can the USPS outright refuse to deliver all valid and legally paid for mail from a sender? I don't think so but can be corrected.
Re: Swedish court rules against Tesla in dispute with postal service over deliveries
#20Earlier quoted context omitted.
According to Tesla, the agreement which employees have in Sweden is already better than the minimum bar set by union, so Teslas issues appears to more out of principle than out of actual issues with the agreement itself. Or Tesla is lying and the agreement with employees is not actually better.
I’ve heard some form of this from every company fighting unions. If that’s really the case, wouldn’t it be beneficial to the finances of the company overall if the union is requesting less benefits?
Unions set the lower bar but if you want to be competitive you still offer higher rates. I guess Musk could sign this and give everyone a pay cut!