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Disturbed Lands (National Park Service)

nps.gov

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Re: Disturbed Lands (National Park Service)

#11

Post by lisper »

Xeoncross wrote: post #4

I wonder how many National Parks will exist for exploration by my grandchildren or great grandchildren. I've already seen so many trails, rivers, or "attractions" closed because some entitled guest (or guests) decided they were allowed to do ____. The end result is a restriction on all visitors. Eventually, I fear the only way to enjoy the old caves, or wind-swept dunes or delicate back country will be to have money,…

Unless we start doing something radical about climate change damn soon, national parks are going to be the least of your grandchildren's worries.

Re: Disturbed Lands (National Park Service)

#12

Post by thwarted »

Xeoncross wrote: post #4

I wonder how many National Parks will exist for exploration by my grandchildren or great grandchildren. I've already seen so many trails, rivers, or "attractions" closed because some entitled guest (or guests) decided they were allowed to do ____. The end result is a restriction on all visitors. Eventually, I fear the only way to enjoy the old caves, or wind-swept dunes or delicate back country will be to have money,…

Tragedy of the Commons Ruins Everything Around Me.

Re: Disturbed Lands (National Park Service)

#13

Post by starbase »

boringg wrote: post #8
danboarder wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interestingly, terms used by developers and builders tend to have a positive bias, for example when roads and buildings are also referred to as resources and "improvements to the land". I am fascinated by how different contexts and mental lenses or framing can bias the perspective on a thing like a road or building or other "disturbance".

Maybe human disturbance would help you frame it better?

Or if you view humans as part of nature: human contribution

Re: Disturbed Lands (National Park Service)

#14

Post by nine_k »

Retric wrote: post #3
danboarder wrote: post #2

I can appreciate that the term "disturbed" has a negative implied bias, but I wish the author would provide the foundational basis upon which the reader should believe or accept this assumption. The terminology later used is "loss of resources" but by definition a resource is "something that is available for use or that can be used". https://www.wordnik.com/words/resource

Many resources go away when you extract them. A forest has wood, an empty field that used to be a forest doesn’t. Disturbed land can still be valuable, but it’s much faster to turn a forest into a field than the reverse.

That's a fun example. Both forests and fields are known for being.highly renewable resources. With a right cutting and seeding policy, a forest can keep giving wood for ventures, and likely indefinitely. A field can keep bringing yields for a very long tome, too, given correct fallowing and rotation of crops.

Mineral resources, such as ore deposits, are very unlike that.

Re: Disturbed Lands (National Park Service)

#15

Post by danboarder »

boringg wrote: post #8
danboarder wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interestingly, terms used by developers and builders tend to have a positive bias, for example when roads and buildings are also referred to as resources and "improvements to the land". I am fascinated by how different contexts and mental lenses or framing can bias the perspective on a thing like a road or building or other "disturbance".

Maybe human disturbance would help you frame it better?

In the article a point is made that not all "disturbance" is of human origin, referencing natural storms and floods as examples.

To consider another perspective, if one's preferred aesthetic is grassland plains, than the natural emergence of trees might be considered a disturbance.

In common lexicon, the term disturbed is also used in reference to a 'disturbed person', as in a mentally disturbed person -- generally also a negative or undesirable status, so in that context I would agree these negative or positive predispositions tend to be psychological phenomenon driven by conscious or unconscious perspectives.

Re: Disturbed Lands (National Park Service)

#16

Post by jcranmer »

Xeoncross wrote: post #4

I wonder how many National Parks will exist for exploration by my grandchildren or great grandchildren. I've already seen so many trails, rivers, or "attractions" closed because some entitled guest (or guests) decided they were allowed to do ____. The end result is a restriction on all visitors. Eventually, I fear the only way to enjoy the old caves, or wind-swept dunes or delicate back country will be to have money,…

Probably most of them; it's more the case that a few of the National Parks are just too overcrowded--Shenandoah and Yosemite probably the worst of the lot. Although some of the National Parks do have issues that aren't related to overvisitation (Hawaii Volcanoes and Everglades both come to mind).

Re: Disturbed Lands (National Park Service)

#18

Post by Two4 »

thwarted wrote: post #12
Xeoncross wrote: post #4

I wonder how many National Parks will exist for exploration by my grandchildren or great grandchildren. I've already seen so many trails, rivers, or "attractions" closed because some entitled guest (or guests) decided they were allowed to do ____. The end result is a restriction on all visitors. Eventually, I fear the only way to enjoy the old caves, or wind-swept dunes or delicate back country will be to have money,…

Tragedy of the Commons Ruins Everything Around Me.

Ah yes, TotCREAM, my favourite Wu Tang jam

Re: Disturbed Lands (National Park Service)

#19

Post by throwaway892238 »

There's not a lot of detail on this page. Shenandoah definitely has a mix of wild and disturbed areas...

I'm kind of amazed they finally introduced ticketing for Old Rag: https://www.nps.gov/shen/planyourvisit/faqs-oldrag.htm We've known for years that way too many people try to go on this difficult hike, to the point where if your hike didn't start at 9am you might be out there all day due to the log-jam of people in the narrows. Happy to see that they're improving the overall experience by putting reasonable limits on the number of visitors.

Re: Disturbed Lands (National Park Service)

#20

Post by geodel »

randycupertino wrote: post #17

I remember how amazing Yosemite was during COVID when it was reservation-only. We felt like we had the place to ourselves. So peaceful and stunning without the hordes and the traffic jams. Truly a great national park experience.

Agree. Nowadays I think nobody goes to Yosemite national park as it is just too crowded.
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