Calorie restriction in humans builds strong muscle and stimulates healthy aging • Hacker News Board

Re: Calorie restriction in humans builds strong muscle and stimulates healthy aging

#11

Post by e12e » Sat, Oct 14, 2023, 8:29 PM UTC

alexey-salmin wrote: post #9

livueta wrote: post #5

I did a bit of a double-take at the headline because it seems to imply that one can grow stronger while calorie-restricted, which is contrary to common practice around strength development - caloric surplus is generally understood to be necessary for muscle growth. I've only read the abstract, but the title as I interpreted it seems misleading: > One study showed that individuals on calorie restriction lost muscle ma…

Increased power over weight ratio does count as "increased strength" IMO. You will run and bike much faster for one thing.

Might not wrestle better in open weight class, chop as much wood or shovel as much snow or dirt, though ?

Re: Calorie restriction in humans builds strong muscle and stimulates healthy aging

#12

Post by idopmstuff » Sat, Oct 14, 2023, 8:34 PM UTC

e12e wrote: post #11

alexey-salmin wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Increased power over weight ratio does count as "increased strength" IMO. You will run and bike much faster for one thing.

Might not wrestle better in open weight class, chop as much wood or shovel as much snow or dirt, though ?

Wrestling seems like exactly the wrong thing to cite here, since it's generally not done in openweight, and if you're wrestling in traditional weight classes then what's described here is hugely beneficial - you can drop a weight class but not lose strength.

Re: Calorie restriction in humans builds strong muscle and stimulates healthy aging

#13

Post by fortran77 » Sat, Oct 14, 2023, 8:45 PM UTC

polishdude20 wrote: post #2

Any calorie based study when it's self reported should be highly suspect of being false.

One of my favorite studies, an oft-replicated and cited study, tracks several hundred people who claimed to be "diet resistant". Using a technique invloving "doubly-lableled water" they were able to determine that every single person in the study who claimed to be diet resistant was overreporting their exercise and underreporting their calorie intake:

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/nejm199212313272701

Of course, this was a study of obese people. If you're doing a study on healty-weight people who are trying to build muscle, you may get far fewer people who will lie.

Re: Calorie restriction in humans builds strong muscle and stimulates healthy aging

#14

Post by cko » Sat, Oct 14, 2023, 8:51 PM UTC

atum47 wrote: post #7

12% reduction of what? The basal metabolism? Were the people overeating before? How many calories on average?

I never get this "calorie restriction" term. What does it mean? I have a BMI of 20. Should I reduce my intake by 12%? When do I stop reducing?

I want to live longer. I would also like to build some more muscle, ideally to a BMI of 22. What if I gain 10lbs of muscle then restrict?

Re: Calorie restriction in humans builds strong muscle and stimulates healthy aging

#15

Post by ibejoeb » Sat, Oct 14, 2023, 8:52 PM UTC

idopmstuff wrote: post #12

e12e wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Might not wrestle better in open weight class, chop as much wood or shovel as much snow or dirt, though ?

Wrestling seems like exactly the wrong thing to cite here, since it's generally not done in openweight, and if you're wrestling in traditional weight classes then what's described here is hugely beneficial - you can drop a weight class but not lose strength.

> you can drop a weight class but not lose strength.

Exactly. This aligns to strategic weight cutting. Once you go up and then go back down, you feel stronger than you were for about as long as you continue regular training.

Re: Calorie restriction in humans builds strong muscle and stimulates healthy aging

#16

Post by hardwaresofton » Sat, Oct 14, 2023, 8:54 PM UTC

> They found that during a two-year span, the goal for participants was to reduce their daily caloric intake by 25%, but the highest the group was able to reach was a 12% reduction

This feels like something the royal we should be talking about as well.

It’s clearly really difficult to restrict calories/eat less in the US. It’s unclear if this is a US only phenomenon or not but I wouldn’t be surprised if it were.

Re: Calorie restriction in humans builds strong muscle and stimulates healthy aging

#17

Post by Not_John » Sat, Oct 14, 2023, 8:55 PM UTC

atum47 wrote: post #7

12% reduction of what? The basal metabolism? Were the people overeating before? How many calories on average?

"It compared outcomes in a group assigned a target of 25% CR (i.e., a 25% reduction in energy intake below baseline levels) with outcomes in an ad libitum diet control group. "

and

"... CALERIE TM participant requirements included:

    Absence of significant health problems, including diabetes, cancer, heart  and liver disease, and AIDS 
    Absence of medication use except oral contraceptives 
    Age from 20 to 50 (inclusive) for men and ages 20-47 (inclusive) for women
    Body mass index (BMI) of 22-27.9 (lean to slightly overweight) 
    No recent substantial weight loss
    No history of eating disorders, behavioral, or psychiatric problems 
    Use by women of an acceptable form of contraception throughout the study"

Source - https://calerie.duke.edu/background

Re: Calorie restriction in humans builds strong muscle and stimulates healthy aging

#18

Post by throwawaaarrgh » Sat, Oct 14, 2023, 9:12 PM UTC

hardwaresofton wrote: post #16

> They found that during a two-year span, the goal for participants was to reduce their daily caloric intake by 25%, but the highest the group was able to reach was a 12% reduction This feels like something the royal we should be talking about as well. It’s clearly really difficult to restrict calories/eat less in the US. It’s unclear if this is a US only phenomenon or not but I wouldn’t be surprised if it were.

It's not hard to restrict calories in the US if that's what you've always done, but if you grew up eating a lot, it's hard to stop eating a lot. Doesn't matter where you are in the world, it's just hard to change your lifestyle long-term.

Re: Calorie restriction in humans builds strong muscle and stimulates healthy aging

#19

Post by hanniabu » Sat, Oct 14, 2023, 9:14 PM UTC

idopmstuff wrote: post #12

e12e wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Might not wrestle better in open weight class, chop as much wood or shovel as much snow or dirt, though ?

Wrestling seems like exactly the wrong thing to cite here, since it's generally not done in openweight, and if you're wrestling in traditional weight classes then what's described here is hugely beneficial - you can drop a weight class but not lose strength.

Also your opponent would have an advantage of you being lighter, which affects the results

Re: Calorie restriction in humans builds strong muscle and stimulates healthy aging

#20

Post by abletonlive » Sat, Oct 14, 2023, 9:22 PM UTC

livueta wrote: post #5

I did a bit of a double-take at the headline because it seems to imply that one can grow stronger while calorie-restricted, which is contrary to common practice around strength development - caloric surplus is generally understood to be necessary for muscle growth. I've only read the abstract, but the title as I interpreted it seems misleading: > One study showed that individuals on calorie restriction lost muscle ma…

> which is contrary to common practice around strength development

This belief is already changing in bodybuilding and strength circles. Surprisingly, the fitness influencers on tiktok are leading the charge in changing minds about this.