How unions won a 30% raise for every fast food worker in California • Hacker News Board

Re: How unions won a 30% raise for every fast food worker in California

#11

Post by ericmcer » Mon, Sep 18, 2023, 9:23 PM UTC

gdulli wrote: post #6

garciasn wrote: post #2

Most of the McDs around me are already paying $17-20 (in Minnesota, including rural areas) and the menu prices reflect it. We recently have begun to pay >$50 for a family of four. For context: the two cheeseburger meal is now just under $11. Subway is the same thing, with most sandwiches topping $10/ea and totals coming out around $50 for four of us. What is interesting, however, is that we're not witnessing this wit…

I've also noticed that the economics of fast food make no sense anymore compared to groceries and casual restaurants. Inflation has hit everything, but fast food has not retained the relative discount. A footlong basic chicken sub at a Subway near me is $13. A "Supreme Meats" is over $18. A "Beast" (whatever that is) is $21! All without a side or drink. Taco Bell and Wendys are similarly out of my guilty pleasure rot…

Visited Subway for the first time in ~10 years.

Growing up their jingle was "$5 foot long" (this lasted til 2011 or so?). I figured there was no way a $5 price held, but I did not expect it to have almost tripled.

Re: How unions won a 30% raise for every fast food worker in California

#12

Post by gdulli » Mon, Sep 18, 2023, 9:33 PM UTC

tschwimmer wrote: post #10

gdulli wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've also noticed that the economics of fast food make no sense anymore compared to groceries and casual restaurants. Inflation has hit everything, but fast food has not retained the relative discount. A footlong basic chicken sub at a Subway near me is $13. A "Supreme Meats" is over $18. A "Beast" (whatever that is) is $21! All without a side or drink. Taco Bell and Wendys are similarly out of my guilty pleasure rot…

What I've noticed is there there is a huge "app subsidy" (drive through tax?) for many fast food chains. For example, Taco Bell has a $6 online-only combo that's probably 40-60% discount over the drive-thru menu equivalent. I've noticed similar things with other chains as well. As a business strategy, this makes some minor amount of sense since the app orders are transparently more efficient than drive through orders…

I will absolutely not install an app to order food. But if it means Taco Bell is no longer part of my diet I'll take it as a win.

Re: How unions won a 30% raise for every fast food worker in California

#13

Post by rngname22 » Mon, Sep 18, 2023, 9:51 PM UTC

OfSanguineFire wrote: post #8

garciasn wrote: post #2

Most of the McDs around me are already paying $17-20 (in Minnesota, including rural areas) and the menu prices reflect it. We recently have begun to pay >$50 for a family of four. For context: the two cheeseburger meal is now just under $11. Subway is the same thing, with most sandwiches topping $10/ea and totals coming out around $50 for four of us. What is interesting, however, is that we're not witnessing this wit…

Considering that the USA has higher salaries overall than Norway or Switzerland and comparable cost of living, it seems like the USA is just catching up and being on the level one would expect it. In those countries, a fast-food meal is around US$20. Traditional restaurants and/or fast casual spots in the USA involve “mandatory” tipping, so even if menu prices are lower, I would assume that the total meal price is hi…

Total comp + benefits + social welfare for a fast food worker in Norway or Switzerland is far better than the equivalent for a fast food worker in Minnesota, the price rising in Minnesota to match Norway would not be commensurate as the Minnesota worker has far worse lifestyle economically.

Re: How unions won a 30% raise for every fast food worker in California

#14

Post by OfSanguineFire » Mon, Sep 18, 2023, 10:02 PM UTC

rngname22 wrote: post #13

OfSanguineFire wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Considering that the USA has higher salaries overall than Norway or Switzerland and comparable cost of living, it seems like the USA is just catching up and being on the level one would expect it. In those countries, a fast-food meal is around US$20. Traditional restaurants and/or fast casual spots in the USA involve “mandatory” tipping, so even if menu prices are lower, I would assume that the total meal price is hi…

Total comp + benefits + social welfare for a fast food worker in Norway or Switzerland is far better than the equivalent for a fast food worker in Minnesota, the price rising in Minnesota to match Norway would not be commensurate as the Minnesota worker has far worse lifestyle economically.

I wasn’t thinking of the fast-food workers but rather the clientele. With American salaries being as high as they are, and a lot of other things in life being priced relatively high, I would have expected the American fast-food industry to easily get away with raising prices up to $20/meal, at least in some US markets.

Re: How unions won a 30% raise for every fast food worker in California

#15

Post by bsder » Mon, Sep 18, 2023, 10:32 PM UTC

gdulli wrote: post #6

garciasn wrote: post #2

Most of the McDs around me are already paying $17-20 (in Minnesota, including rural areas) and the menu prices reflect it. We recently have begun to pay >$50 for a family of four. For context: the two cheeseburger meal is now just under $11. Subway is the same thing, with most sandwiches topping $10/ea and totals coming out around $50 for four of us. What is interesting, however, is that we're not witnessing this wit…

I've also noticed that the economics of fast food make no sense anymore compared to groceries and casual restaurants. Inflation has hit everything, but fast food has not retained the relative discount. A footlong basic chicken sub at a Subway near me is $13. A "Supreme Meats" is over $18. A "Beast" (whatever that is) is $21! All without a side or drink. Taco Bell and Wendys are similarly out of my guilty pleasure rot…

> I've also noticed that the economics of fast food make no sense anymore compared to groceries

The deli sandwich thing, in particular, seems to have really broken the social compact.

Their ingredients aren't better. Their price isn't better. Their service isn't better.

It has become not uncommon for me to say "Yeah, I'll go to the grocery store and hit the deli because it's better and more convenient."

How many more people like me will it take before all the sandwich places collapse?

Re: How unions won a 30% raise for every fast food worker in California

#16

Post by jiofj » Mon, Sep 18, 2023, 10:33 PM UTC

garciasn wrote: post #2

Most of the McDs around me are already paying $17-20 (in Minnesota, including rural areas) and the menu prices reflect it. We recently have begun to pay >$50 for a family of four. For context: the two cheeseburger meal is now just under $11. Subway is the same thing, with most sandwiches topping $10/ea and totals coming out around $50 for four of us. What is interesting, however, is that we're not witnessing this wit…

>We recently have begun to pay >$50 for a family of four.

It's incredible how inflated prices for fast food are. It's the same crap as always but it costs the same as going to a real restaurant.

Re: How unions won a 30% raise for every fast food worker in California

#17

Post by fragmede » Mon, Sep 18, 2023, 10:34 PM UTC

gdulli wrote: post #12

tschwimmer wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What I've noticed is there there is a huge "app subsidy" (drive through tax?) for many fast food chains. For example, Taco Bell has a $6 online-only combo that's probably 40-60% discount over the drive-thru menu equivalent. I've noticed similar things with other chains as well. As a business strategy, this makes some minor amount of sense since the app orders are transparently more efficient than drive through orders…

I will absolutely not install an app to order food. But if it means Taco Bell is no longer part of my diet I'll take it as a win.

Is it just a general fear of technology as to why or is there some other reason why you don't want to install an app?

Re: How unions won a 30% raise for every fast food worker in California

#18

Post by acdha » Mon, Sep 18, 2023, 10:34 PM UTC

tschwimmer wrote: post #10

gdulli wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've also noticed that the economics of fast food make no sense anymore compared to groceries and casual restaurants. Inflation has hit everything, but fast food has not retained the relative discount. A footlong basic chicken sub at a Subway near me is $13. A "Supreme Meats" is over $18. A "Beast" (whatever that is) is $21! All without a side or drink. Taco Bell and Wendys are similarly out of my guilty pleasure rot…

What I've noticed is there there is a huge "app subsidy" (drive through tax?) for many fast food chains. For example, Taco Bell has a $6 online-only combo that's probably 40-60% discount over the drive-thru menu equivalent. I've noticed similar things with other chains as well. As a business strategy, this makes some minor amount of sense since the app orders are transparently more efficient than drive through orders…

I wonder whether their subsidizing the app orders to push users over: not just because they can presumably mine other data but because they can hire fewer cashiers and maybe keep their kitchen utilization up if there’s never a delay due to someone slow ahead of you in line. It would not be surprising to see a logical endpoint here treating the cash register like banks treated ATMs where there’s eventually a charge to talk to a person (who might be on video so they can farm it out to a call center?).

Re: How unions won a 30% raise for every fast food worker in California

#19

Post by seanmcdirmid » Mon, Sep 18, 2023, 10:37 PM UTC

OfSanguineFire wrote: post #8

garciasn wrote: post #2

Most of the McDs around me are already paying $17-20 (in Minnesota, including rural areas) and the menu prices reflect it. We recently have begun to pay >$50 for a family of four. For context: the two cheeseburger meal is now just under $11. Subway is the same thing, with most sandwiches topping $10/ea and totals coming out around $50 for four of us. What is interesting, however, is that we're not witnessing this wit…

Considering that the USA has higher salaries overall than Norway or Switzerland and comparable cost of living, it seems like the USA is just catching up and being on the level one would expect it. In those countries, a fast-food meal is around US$20. Traditional restaurants and/or fast casual spots in the USA involve “mandatory” tipping, so even if menu prices are lower, I would assume that the total meal price is hi…

Oh man, I remember being shocked a Big Mac Meal went for 11 CHF in Lausanne in...2006. It must be up to at least 20 CHF now.

I just got back from Japan, however, and I was absolutely spoiled by how affordable eating out was, really good food and no tipping culture. Heck, even the convenience stores in Japan provide better options than most fast food restaurants in the states. But I got a sense that the workers are struggling with the current system.

Re: How unions won a 30% raise for every fast food worker in California

#20

Post by reducesuffering » Mon, Sep 18, 2023, 10:56 PM UTC

tschwimmer wrote: post #10

gdulli wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've also noticed that the economics of fast food make no sense anymore compared to groceries and casual restaurants. Inflation has hit everything, but fast food has not retained the relative discount. A footlong basic chicken sub at a Subway near me is $13. A "Supreme Meats" is over $18. A "Beast" (whatever that is) is $21! All without a side or drink. Taco Bell and Wendys are similarly out of my guilty pleasure rot…

What I've noticed is there there is a huge "app subsidy" (drive through tax?) for many fast food chains. For example, Taco Bell has a $6 online-only combo that's probably 40-60% discount over the drive-thru menu equivalent. I've noticed similar things with other chains as well. As a business strategy, this makes some minor amount of sense since the app orders are transparently more efficient than drive through orders…

App subsidy / price discrimination is real. You can get $5 taco bell meals, $8 McD double quarter pounder meals, and $2 dunkin coffee and donut if you know where to look. They all then have rewards that is another 7-10% cash back.