This was a hard read. What is the best move if stuck in gridlock with fires oncoming?
GTFO of the car and run
Maui residents who disobeyed barricades survived fires
11–20 of 142 posts
Re: Maui residents who disobeyed barricades survived fires
#12Is there any actual evidence for this? The article is all hearsay...
Re: Maui residents who disobeyed barricades survived fires
#13With the level of incompetence being shown by officials, I think it's not too far fetched to consider jail time for them. They'll plead ignorance of course, but there were warnings and these deaths are on them.
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Re: Maui residents who disobeyed barricades survived fires
#14People follow directions because they think the people giving them know what's best. Too late, they realize those people are only following directions given to them by someone else, further from the scene, with even less at stake. In a crisis, we need to be able to distinguish between the urge to act, and the urge to panic. It's very difficult. And it's more complicated than that, because sometimes those distant planners are right. But, unavoidably, you're the one responsible for your safety, not the police or the government, or an orange traffic cone, or a barricade.
Re: Maui residents who disobeyed barricades survived fires
#15With the level of incompetence being shown by officials, I think it's not too far fetched to consider jail time for them. They'll plead ignorance of course, but there were warnings and these deaths are on them.
What were the warnings they should've heeded differently?
A state official delayed releasing water for firefighting efforts over a water usage dispute:
https://www.civilbeat.org/2023/08/a-state-official-refused-t...
This water dispute has been going on for a while. From that article: "In 2022, two Maui senators, Gil Keith-Agaran and Lynne DeCoite, introduced a measure to push DLNR to allow fresh water to be used to fight fires and pointed to West Maui as being particularly vulnerable." The measure didn't go anywhere.
Re: Maui residents who disobeyed barricades survived fires
#16With the level of incompetence being shown by officials, I think it's not too far fetched to consider jail time for them. They'll plead ignorance of course, but there were warnings and these deaths are on them.
It is easy to blame people but it changes nothing, of course they committed errors but it is unlikely they did it aiming to kill their people. Media and Humans have this strange desire to see blood instead to find errors on the process and procedures and then change it to avoid future errors.
For example, media blame they to not turn on the sirens but sirens are for tsunamis and weren’t placed on mountains and the procedure for sirens is go to mountains (the opposite of what should be done).
Re: Maui residents who disobeyed barricades survived fires
#17Is there any actual evidence for this? The article is all hearsay...
Quoting an actual person at the scene is not hearsay, is it?
Re: Maui residents who disobeyed barricades survived fires
#18Wow... I definitely would have obeyed the barricades and trusted the police. I'll definitely think twice in the future.
Yeah, if I'm trying to escape something like a fire and see a barricade I'm going to think the officials that placed it know that taking that route would be jumping from the frying pan to the fire. Obviously they were very wrong in this case--blocking a "bad" option when the alternatives were much worse.
Re: Maui residents who disobeyed barricades survived fires
#19Tragic events like this can be a reminder that the only person responsible for your safety is You. You Cannot rely on "officials" or rules to care more about you than you do. Trust your gut, maintain awareness. Do not be lulled into complacency by safety theatre.
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Re: Maui residents who disobeyed barricades survived fires
#20Survival is almost always increased by ignoring government officials, I dont know why we have to keep relearning this lesson over and over again but some people still follow government like they have some divine knowledge Government works best which is subservient to the people, the second it becomes something else bad things will happen
No. Government generally has a much better big picture than you do and thus is more likely to get it right.
Where they typically get it wrong is avoiding a known small risk vs a possible bigger risk. However, in this case it seems to be a known small risk vs a certain much bigger risk.