I definitely like the flexibility to be able to create a custom solution with a yaml file. Nice idea. All the best!
Launch HN: Grai (YC S22) – Open-Source Data Observability Platform
11–20 of 46 posts
Re: Launch HN: Grai (YC S22) – Open-Source Data Observability Platform
#12The license chosen [1] (Elastic License 2.0) is one that isn't considered open source by many, due to not being OSD [2] compatible. Were you aware of this before marketing as open source and, out of interest, does the license & usage of "open source" come into conversation when going through the YC process? [1] https://github.com/grai-io/grai-core/blob/master/LICENSE [2] https://opensource.org/osd/
We are pretty open to feedback on licensing and have gone back and forth internally because, frankly, we'd rather use a copy-left license.
We believe a project like this needs financial backing and a dedicated team driving development along but therein lies the tension. The common monetization paths either feature-lock critical self-hosted capabilities like SSO behind a paywall and/or monetize behind a cloud hosted option.
The Elastic license is an attempt to maintain feature parity between the cloud and self-hosted tool while still being protected from something like the big cloud providers ripping the code off altogether.
In all seriousness though, we would love to hear suggestions if you think there's a better path.
Re: Launch HN: Grai (YC S22) – Open-Source Data Observability Platform
#13The license chosen [1] (Elastic License 2.0) is one that isn't considered open source by many, due to not being OSD [2] compatible. Were you aware of this before marketing as open source and, out of interest, does the license & usage of "open source" come into conversation when going through the YC process? [1] https://github.com/grai-io/grai-core/blob/master/LICENSE [2] https://opensource.org/osd/
Indeed, it's "source available" at best, not open source as it limits how other parties can use the software, even if the creators don't like their use.
Just to be clear, the only limitation imposed by the license is preventing someone from reselling a cloud hosted copy of the tool. The code is otherwise totally free to use fork / modify / etc...
Re: Launch HN: Grai (YC S22) – Open-Source Data Observability Platform
#14Earlier quoted context omitted.
Indeed, it's "source available" at best, not open source as it limits how other parties can use the software, even if the creators don't like their use.
Just to be clear, the only limitation imposed by the license is preventing someone from reselling a cloud hosted copy of the tool. The code is otherwise totally free to use fork / modify / etc...
That's great, it's not open source though so you shouldn't call it open source. Call it something else.
Re: Launch HN: Grai (YC S22) – Open-Source Data Observability Platform
#15Website looks great! Just FYI, I’m getting a “failed to load search index” error in your docs. Also I saw GitHub Actions called out in the workflow. Do you have GitLab support?
Thanks so much! Really appreciate the kind words.
We haven't had anyone request Gitlab yet but would love to add support! Any chance you'd be willing to beta test for us? If so, shoot me an email at ian@grai.io :).
EDIT: It looks like the index issue is related to our search provider. Were you able to eventually load the page or is it fully blocking you?
Re: Launch HN: Grai (YC S22) – Open-Source Data Observability Platform
#16Elastic v2 if one is interested in such things: https://github.com/grai-io/grai-core/blob/v0.1.33/LICENSE
Re: Launch HN: Grai (YC S22) – Open-Source Data Observability Platform
#17The license chosen [1] (Elastic License 2.0) is one that isn't considered open source by many, due to not being OSD [2] compatible. Were you aware of this before marketing as open source and, out of interest, does the license & usage of "open source" come into conversation when going through the YC process? [1] https://github.com/grai-io/grai-core/blob/master/LICENSE [2] https://opensource.org/osd/
We are pretty open to feedback on licensing and have gone back and forth internally because, frankly, we'd rather use a copy-left license. We believe a project like this needs financial backing and a dedicated team driving development along but therein lies the tension. The common monetization paths either feature-lock critical self-hosted capabilities like SSO behind a paywall and/or monetize behind a cloud hosted o…
I personally don't have anything against the license you've chosen, and I respect your right to protect your efforts against usage you don't desire. I just think it's better to avoid using "open source" if going down the ELv2 path, and using something like "source available" or "fair code" instead to prevent confusion in misrepresenting this as, what is commonly considered, open source.
If you'd like further detail in regards to why I (and others) think this matters, I've previously written my thoughts up here: https://danb.me/blog/posts/why-open-source-term-is-important...
Re: Launch HN: Grai (YC S22) – Open-Source Data Observability Platform
#18Earlier quoted context omitted.
We are pretty open to feedback on licensing and have gone back and forth internally because, frankly, we'd rather use a copy-left license. We believe a project like this needs financial backing and a dedicated team driving development along but therein lies the tension. The common monetization paths either feature-lock critical self-hosted capabilities like SSO behind a paywall and/or monetize behind a cloud hosted o…
I personally don't have anything against the license you've chosen, and I respect your right to protect your efforts against usage you don't desire. I just think it's better to avoid using "open source" if going down the ELv2 path, and using something like "source available" or "fair code" instead to prevent confusion in misrepresenting this as, what is commonly considered, open source. If you'd like further detail i…
Totally fair and appreciate the (well written) thoughts.
Re: Launch HN: Grai (YC S22) – Open-Source Data Observability Platform
#19Earlier quoted context omitted.
We are pretty open to feedback on licensing and have gone back and forth internally because, frankly, we'd rather use a copy-left license. We believe a project like this needs financial backing and a dedicated team driving development along but therein lies the tension. The common monetization paths either feature-lock critical self-hosted capabilities like SSO behind a paywall and/or monetize behind a cloud hosted o…
I personally don't have anything against the license you've chosen, and I respect your right to protect your efforts against usage you don't desire. I just think it's better to avoid using "open source" if going down the ELv2 path, and using something like "source available" or "fair code" instead to prevent confusion in misrepresenting this as, what is commonly considered, open source. If you'd like further detail i…
This question is for my education alone, but since you seem quite passionate I am curious.
I just read a super long article about licensing to understand your comment as well as the article you wrote. Under these "source available" licenses, I can still sell the software within some kind of package correct? Like if I create my own PR linter I can use Grai and still sell it? I just can't host grai with some observability and sell it? Or am I misunderstanding?
Re: Launch HN: Grai (YC S22) – Open-Source Data Observability Platform
#20[deleted]