Live data from Hacker News

Maybe you should store passwords in plaintext

qword.net

11–20 of 147 posts

Re: Maybe you should store passwords in plaintext

#11
“You don’t get rewarded for being extra. You don’t get any money when you save costs. You’re going to get a raise below inflation. You’re stupid for caring the way that you do. The business’ downside risk is not yours, and it’s profits are not yours either.”

Except when you're granted RSUs or participate in some private company's profit sharing scheme. So if that's important to you, find such a place. The smaller the company, the more impact you can have on their profits.

Re: Maybe you should store passwords in plaintext

#12
My eyes really opened to this during the pandemic and its aftermath.

Working from home I did almost nothing productive. Got paid the same.

Returning to the office, I noticed half the people still seemed to be working from home most days, so I started doing that too. And did almost nothing productive. Nobody apparently noticed or cared. Got paid the same.

Got the same raise (yes, below inflation).

So now I have given myself a >4x raise by working about 10 hours a week of real work (and that's a high estimate). I work on whatever tasks are currently on the radar, do the least amount necessary, and ignore everything else. I get paid the same.

Re: Maybe you should store passwords in plaintext

#13
post #11

“You don’t get rewarded for being extra. You don’t get any money when you save costs. You’re going to get a raise below inflation. You’re stupid for caring the way that you do. The business’ downside risk is not yours, and it’s profits are not yours either.” Except when you're granted RSUs or participate in some private company's profit sharing scheme. So if that's important to you, find such a place. The smaller the…

Typically those equity schemes will amount to nothing for most employees at small companies. They're a little better than buying a lottery ticket every week.

Re: Maybe you should store passwords in plaintext

#14
I agree with Nihilartikel’s comment. It’s nice when you’re the one doing business development.

But as a manager at any organization, the correct answer is to fire people like this because they become insidious and take over your business.

Have a moral backbone.

Is it fair? No. Lots of corporate decision making will never ever be fair. Deal with it, or work with these people. Find ways to financially incentivize morally correct behavior and exceptional engineering. The latter is important because good people leave and they’re literally worth more than your other employees.

Oh and by the way, they’re disgusting to work with, and regardless of your moral compass they will make you a worse engineer.

I worked with these types of people at my last job.

One guy didn’t know how to fork a repo and maintain an internal copy of a project with clean portable diffs.

The other was afraid of regular expressions and didn’t understand libc versioning.

Losers behave like losers.

Re: Maybe you should store passwords in plaintext

#15
#3 (mediocre work after an effective pay cut) doesn't sound at all unreasonable. In effect those people are getting a pay cut and decided that investing effort to be "top-notch" is not justified. They're doing a mediocre job - by definition middle, not low quality. The author tries to paint this in a very bad light but I think this is a mentality of "it's bad because someone else does it".

For some of those people the issue is not financial but one of respect. A little spit in their eye is still spit in their eye.

What's a reasonable amount to cut from an agreed payment while still expecting top notch quality? How much does the author like to give up in such conditions?

Re: Maybe you should store passwords in plaintext

#16

I disagree with the author that normal people don't think this way. Most people I know won't go out of their way to help their employer. In my experience you can usually find a few people who care about doing things right and they work hard, are passionate, go above and beyond, etc. Almost everyone else is in a different lane. Some are in the far right lane, where they cleverly exploiting things (as a few people ment…

I can't remember the comedian but there was a joke I heard that really hit this home: People don't get paid because they like their work. They get paid because they don't like their work.

Re: Maybe you should store passwords in plaintext

#17

I am basically that employee in several ways. I know about wasteful cloud spend that I do nothing about. My last comment on HN actually was asking if anyone could give me a reason to report that cloud waste. The best arguments were for the sake of the environment and to build credibility with co-workers to make it easier to jump ship. Nothing from the company at all. I can't say I deliberately ship bugs, but I don't…

I’m hanging onto this post for the next time I see people on their high horse about integrity among engineers. The fact is, some people have it and some don’t, regardless of job. This makes me sad. Economically it makes sense, but it’s a sign of the sickness in our modern society. Everyone looking out for themselves first without much thought to the community around them. I say this having been burned by employees like this (that did maybe, maybe, an hour’s worth of remote work per day). Maybe it all boils down to “this is why we can’t have nice things”.

Re: Maybe you should store passwords in plaintext

#18

My eyes really opened to this during the pandemic and its aftermath. Working from home I did almost nothing productive. Got paid the same. Returning to the office, I noticed half the people still seemed to be working from home most days, so I started doing that too. And did almost nothing productive. Nobody apparently noticed or cared. Got paid the same. Got the same raise (yes, below inflation). So now I have given…

This just means that your line manager, whose role it is to ensure all resources under them are working at efficient capacity, is not doing his/her job.

And in turn neither is his manager.

Re: Maybe you should store passwords in plaintext

#19

I agree with Nihilartikel’s comment. It’s nice when you’re the one doing business development. But as a manager at any organization, the correct answer is to fire people like this because they become insidious and take over your business. Have a moral backbone. Is it fair? No. Lots of corporate decision making will never ever be fair. Deal with it, or work with these people. Find ways to financially incentivize moral…

As an addendum, you don’t need to kill yourself over your job. Just do what’s asked of you.

But you don’t need to be a parasite either. It’s disgusting and you WILL be remembered for it years later.

Re: Maybe you should store passwords in plaintext

#20
I can’t speak for others, but for myself it’s next to impossible to live a good life while working a job where I sink into a “plaintext passwords” type of mindset.

That being said, I don’t really envy that mindset, I suspect there’s something fundamentally broken about a mind that’s resigned to treating a supposedly symbiotic relationship as adversarial, even though it may be a warranted reaction given how so many companies treat their employees.

Post reply on HN