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Tectonic – A modern, complete, self-contained Tex engine with Unicode support

tectonic-typesetting.github.io

11–20 of 33 posts

Re: Tectonic – A modern, complete, self-contained Tex engine with Unicode support

#11

I used it a bit recently and it is brilliant. Instead of lugging a huge TeX installation around you have a single reasonably sized binary. When you run ’tectonic file.tex’ it will download everything it needs on the fly. If you want to run it without internet access you can sort of freeze the downloaded files and run tectonic with your *.tex plus the frozen bundle. It also claims reasonable error messages but I only…

I've been looking at https://typst.app not tex based, but uses CM fonts. I really think that trying to update the programming parts of TeX is necessary. sadly I'm struggling with fonts in svg figures. but to suddenly see applying effort in this area and getting real traction is treat. so many thanks for the luminaries that put up the last one, but maybe its time for some rework after 40 years.

Sadly it still doesn't support vector graphics. A TeX-killer must also include a replacement for something like PGF, Tikz, Metapost, etc.

Re: Tectonic – A modern, complete, self-contained Tex engine with Unicode support

#12

I used it a bit recently and it is brilliant. Instead of lugging a huge TeX installation around you have a single reasonably sized binary. When you run ’tectonic file.tex’ it will download everything it needs on the fly. If you want to run it without internet access you can sort of freeze the downloaded files and run tectonic with your *.tex plus the frozen bundle. It also claims reasonable error messages but I only…

Integrating TeX into a program inside exactly impossible now though. Pandoc gets along fine.

Also the way to trust code is isolation rather than verification, even rust has unsafe.

Re: Tectonic – A modern, complete, self-contained Tex engine with Unicode support

#13
post #10

I used it a bit recently and it is brilliant. Instead of lugging a huge TeX installation around you have a single reasonably sized binary. When you run ’tectonic file.tex’ it will download everything it needs on the fly. If you want to run it without internet access you can sort of freeze the downloaded files and run tectonic with your *.tex plus the frozen bundle. It also claims reasonable error messages but I only…

> I find it quite disappointing that we do not have 100% compatible LaTeX with a modern codebase That would be a huge effort. Your time would be better spent designing and creating a new typesetting system.

A new typesetting system will be very hard to get people to adopt. There are a million packages and existing documents that would have to be ported over. At this point, compatibility with TeX is a critical feature, not just a nice-to-have.

Re: Tectonic – A modern, complete, self-contained Tex engine with Unicode support

#14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe u/jjgreen is complaining about the curl|bash pattern being used in a Rust codebase.

I think it's worth mentioning that the install line at https://www.rust-lang.org/tools/install looks exactly the same.

Yep, that's the joke.

Re: Tectonic – A modern, complete, self-contained Tex engine with Unicode support

#15
post #10

I used it a bit recently and it is brilliant. Instead of lugging a huge TeX installation around you have a single reasonably sized binary. When you run ’tectonic file.tex’ it will download everything it needs on the fly. If you want to run it without internet access you can sort of freeze the downloaded files and run tectonic with your *.tex plus the frozen bundle. It also claims reasonable error messages but I only…

> I find it quite disappointing that we do not have 100% compatible LaTeX with a modern codebase That would be a huge effort. Your time would be better spent designing and creating a new typesetting system.

New typesetting systems are a dime a dozen and none of them is getting anywhere. Also in almost all cases HTML/CSS is what you want to use anyway. TeX is pretty niche but it fills that niche perfectly. A 100% compatible LaTeX that plays nicely in today's infrastructure is all I want.

Re: Tectonic – A modern, complete, self-contained Tex engine with Unicode support

#16
post #12

I used it a bit recently and it is brilliant. Instead of lugging a huge TeX installation around you have a single reasonably sized binary. When you run ’tectonic file.tex’ it will download everything it needs on the fly. If you want to run it without internet access you can sort of freeze the downloaded files and run tectonic with your *.tex plus the frozen bundle. It also claims reasonable error messages but I only…

Integrating TeX into a program inside exactly impossible now though. Pandoc gets along fine. Also the way to trust code is isolation rather than verification, even rust has unsafe.

Isolation is a good second line of defense. It's not going to prevent malicious input to produce malicious output. At least not until you go as far as Qubes OS and you squeeze everything through a rasterized bitmap.

Re: Tectonic – A modern, complete, self-contained Tex engine with Unicode support

#18
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been looking at https://typst.app not tex based, but uses CM fonts. I really think that trying to update the programming parts of TeX is necessary. sadly I'm struggling with fonts in svg figures. but to suddenly see applying effort in this area and getting real traction is treat. so many thanks for the luminaries that put up the last one, but maybe its time for some rework after 40 years.

Sadly it still doesn't support vector graphics. A TeX-killer must also include a replacement for something like PGF, Tikz, Metapost, etc.

It supports SVGs. Not a replacement for all the options in latex, but that certainly qualifies as "vector graphics".

Re: Tectonic – A modern, complete, self-contained Tex engine with Unicode support

#19
post #2

Written in Rust! Can you tell? curl --proto '=https' --tlsv1.2 -fsSL https://drop-sh.fullyjustified.net | sh

Let’s say, for example, that I invite a friend over and offer them a glass of water. Would you be similarly upset to find that I don’t recommend that they first send a sample of the water to be tested for purity before consuming said glass of water? I mean, don’t get me wrong, I would be fine with my friend being cautious and wanting to get the water tested (though I doubt that would ever happen in practice)… but if he trusts me to give him clean water, I doubt you’d raise any fuss over him just downing a glass.

Why/how is this any different? Anyone that wants to inspect the shell script can amend that line to first save and view the script. Are you thinking it’s never appropriate to trust such a script implicitly? If that’s the case, I’d love to hear about your workflow for checking the packages you install (e.g. debs can run arbitrary post install scripts, and do you know that a malicious actor with signing keys didn’t taint the binaries therein?), how you inspect all JavaScript for sandbox escaping exploits before viewing anything on the web, how you’ve ensured your hardware itself isn’t backdoored, etc.

The complaints of piping directly into shell from an HTTPS server strikes me as nothing more than a “no real technologists does $THING!” sort of elitism, though I’m open to being shown otherwise. A non-answer would be to propose that one first fetch a package signing key and install from your package manager of choice — if the script we’re complaining about can’t be trusted, there’s no reason to trust that the key file is any better with it being hosted in exactly the same way… unless you’re going to propose that you use something along the lines of web-of-trust to inspire further confidence that the signing key is authentic; at that point, though, your problem is with how 99.9% of third-party software packages (with respect to your distro of choice) are distributed - every PPA I’ve ever seen (docker, mongodb, whatever) at best tells you to fetch a key from some HTTPS server, and that’s all. It would then strike me as suspect to single out curl|bash (while additionally implying something about Rust users).

Re: Tectonic – A modern, complete, self-contained Tex engine with Unicode support

#20
post #2

Written in Rust! Can you tell? curl --proto '=https' --tlsv1.2 -fsSL https://drop-sh.fullyjustified.net | sh

Let’s say, for example, that I invite a friend over and offer them a glass of water. Would you be similarly upset to find that I don’t recommend that they first send a sample of the water to be tested for purity before consuming said glass of water? I mean, don’t get me wrong, I would be fine with my friend being cautious and wanting to get the water tested (though I doubt that would ever happen in practice)… but if…

   Anyone that wants to inspect the shell script can amend that line 
   to first save and view the script. 
They can, but they may well not get the same output since, as is well-known, curl | sh can be detected on the server.
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