"Debt, n. An ingenious substitute for the chain and whip of the slavedriver."
- Ambrose Bierce, Devil's Dictionary
Why northern Europe is so indebted (2021)
11–20 of 153 posts
Re: Why northern Europe is so indebted (2021)
#12When you live in a stable society and have gotten a free education and a nice job, it makes sense to get a loan to buy a place to live and start paying a mortgage instead of debt. Contrast with a society where the average education might be lower, less people having a stable job in a slow labor market, and if you lose your job there is no safety net. Hard to get a loan, so end up renting for longer, and in turn have…
That's what the article said. Mortgage debt can be a proxy for privilege, while consumer debt can be a proxy for need.
Re: Why northern Europe is so indebted (2021)
#13[deleted]
Re: Why northern Europe is so indebted (2021)
#14When you live in a stable society and have gotten a free education and a nice job, it makes sense to get a loan to buy a place to live and start paying a mortgage instead of debt. Contrast with a society where the average education might be lower, less people having a stable job in a slow labor market, and if you lose your job there is no safety net. Hard to get a loan, so end up renting for longer, and in turn have…
Also, most europeans tend to settle down, and not move across the continent every few years, so buying instead of renting makes even more sense, since you'll be staying in that house probably for the rest of your life.
Re: Why northern Europe is so indebted (2021)
#15Not Northern Europe, but Czech Resident here. There has been an explosion in house prices here, a truly wild one. I bought my place for 3.6m CZK about 7 years back and according to a recent valuation practices is "worth" nearly double this now. It is fucking wild, and tbh I kind of hate it.
In US markets, prices have basically tripled from what they were 7-9 years ago.
Re: Why northern Europe is so indebted (2021)
#16When you live in a stable society and have gotten a free education and a nice job, it makes sense to get a loan to buy a place to live and start paying a mortgage instead of debt. Contrast with a society where the average education might be lower, less people having a stable job in a slow labor market, and if you lose your job there is no safety net. Hard to get a loan, so end up renting for longer, and in turn have…
Also, most europeans tend to settle down, and not move across the continent every few years, so buying instead of renting makes even more sense, since you'll be staying in that house probably for the rest of your life.
Where the hell are people "moving across the continent every few years"?
Re: Why northern Europe is so indebted (2021)
#17When you live in a stable society and have gotten a free education and a nice job, it makes sense to get a loan to buy a place to live and start paying a mortgage instead of debt. Contrast with a society where the average education might be lower, less people having a stable job in a slow labor market, and if you lose your job there is no safety net. Hard to get a loan, so end up renting for longer, and in turn have…
> and start paying a mortgage instead of debt.
But a mortgage is debt … ?
I’m not sure this accounts for it. Paying a mortgage “instead” implies it’s merely a replacement. But in reality the debt is 2-4x higher than other OECD countries.
This stat makes it sound rather unsustainable:
>Four in 10 mortgage borrowers in Sweden are not paying off their debt, and those that are repaying the principal do so at a rate that would on average take nearly a century.
https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2014/08/24/swedish-household-debt-s...
Re: Why northern Europe is so indebted (2021)
#18Change the title name to be more approptiate. This is about private debt, not total debt.
"Why Northern Europe is so indebted" sounds like clickbait...
Re: Why northern Europe is so indebted (2021)
#19When you live in a stable society and have gotten a free education and a nice job, it makes sense to get a loan to buy a place to live and start paying a mortgage instead of debt. Contrast with a society where the average education might be lower, less people having a stable job in a slow labor market, and if you lose your job there is no safety net. Hard to get a loan, so end up renting for longer, and in turn have…
> When you live in a stable society and have gotten a free education and a nice job
The education isn't free. It's covered by taxes so you, and everyone else, pays for it for a long time. There's quite an expense to have the instructors, buildings, etc.
I'm glad you think the people who haul away garbage, are plumbers, are electricians, etc have nice jobs. Those jobs exist and people do them in those stable societies.
> paying a mortgage instead of debt
A mortgage is a form of debt.
> Contrast with a society where the average education might be lower, less people having a stable job in a slow labor market, and if you lose your job there is no safety net.
This is where things get weirdly complicated. Where I live there are safety nets. The state has said that only about 10% of what's available is used. Where there are safety nets many people don't try to use them. I know people who complained about a lack of safety nets and didn't take advantage of the ones available to them.
> Hard to get a loan, so end up renting for longer, and in turn have a lower average debt.
It's far more complex than that. For example, businesses are buying homes up for far more than asking price and what most people can pay. So they can turn around and rent them. This is all driving up the asking price for homes.
> Debt can be a proxy for a well working society, as you have the means to invest in your future, not just putting out short term fires.
This really depends on where debt is. In the US a lot of debt is to fuel consumerism. Or, to have more things now. A lot of the parts of society drive people to this. It's become cultural.
Re: Why northern Europe is so indebted (2021)
#20Not Northern Europe, but Czech Resident here. There has been an explosion in house prices here, a truly wild one. I bought my place for 3.6m CZK about 7 years back and according to a recent valuation practices is "worth" nearly double this now. It is fucking wild, and tbh I kind of hate it.
In US markets, prices have basically tripled from what they were 7-9 years ago.
That is not accurate, though in some specific regions it may be true. Overall, prices right now are just a little above twice what they were at the low point in 2012 [0]. From 7-9 years ago, even at the high point we were less than double.