Long-Term Cannabis Use, Cognitive Decline, and the Hippocampus • Hacker News Board

Re: Long-Term Cannabis Use, Cognitive Decline, and the Hippocampus

#11

Post by austin-cheney » Fri, Mar 10, 2023, 2:33 PM UTC

varispeed wrote: post #4

AlanYx wrote: post #2

What's most interesting about this article IMHO is that these results were found with "long-term cannabis users" defined as those who use "typically 1-4 times weekly". That seems like relatively casual use.

Author obviously has a conflict of interest. He fails to acknowledge that correlation is not causation and that these studies fail to take into account other variables that could influence the outcomes.

I read the article and did not see anything that would qualify as a conflict. Correlation is not causation only on its face, which is why researchers compare their findings against control groups.

Re: Long-Term Cannabis Use, Cognitive Decline, and the Hippocampus

#12

Post by spoiler » Fri, Mar 10, 2023, 2:34 PM UTC

fallingknife wrote: post #7

I smoked weed constantly in college, and when I stopped, it was like a fog lifted. Its danger was comically exaggerated in the anti-drug propaganda they force fed to kids in the US for so long that a lot of people have a reactionary tendency to assume it's harmless, but they will soon be proven wrong. Still has nothing on America's number 1 hard drug, alcohol, though.

Yeah, I kinda know what you mean by fog. I have a "low key" addiction to weed because I'm a bit emotionally dysregulated and weed helped with that. So, when I'm struggling to cope I sometimes wish I had weed at hand.

However the fog thing is real. I noticed it on myself when I stopped too.

It did without a doubt help me live a somewhat more normal life than if I hadn't been using it at the time.

However eventually as I got better (in general, still got acute episodes), the fog/downside outweighed the benefits.

I think it should be studied more as a form of medication. Maybe smaller doses and administered orally, as to avoid the negative side effects associated with smoking or vaping it

Re: Long-Term Cannabis Use, Cognitive Decline, and the Hippocampus

#13

Post by AnEro » Fri, Mar 10, 2023, 2:36 PM UTC

I also wonder what their lifestyles are in general, and if it would have an effect. I feel like weed puts my brain into autopilot to a degree and makes me 'okay' with w/e I am doing. So recreational usage I could see making you 'dumber' cause weed lets you feel okay doing nothing and doing nothing is a good way to be dumber

My anecdotal opinion for someone that smokes a lot compared to their long-term cannabis users, maybe once or twice a night vs 1 to 4 times weekly. I'm late twenties have been smoking since my early twenties, obsessed with brain optimization and min maxing performance etc. I feel like I've gotten smarter in some areas and dumber in others, which lines up with how weed affects the reward circuits of the brain imho. So I've been using it as a reward for doing stuff I otherwise would be uncomfortable with trying, like a new project or new hobbies; anything worth doing is worth doing poorly. So I think it has helped me get smarter programming and developing intuition on some areas, but since I have avoided writing like the plague it's gotten terrible to be honest. Personally it feels like it just tunnels you in further to what ever you are doing, and possibly makes it harder to stop doing it even not high

Re: Long-Term Cannabis Use, Cognitive Decline, and the Hippocampus

#14

Post by dankai » Fri, Mar 10, 2023, 2:36 PM UTC

Look at the sample sizes and the demographics (https://imgur.com/a/LG5vVMF) of the groups the study (https://moffittcaspi.trinity.duke.edu/sites/moffittcaspi.tri...) compares. Also look at the publication bias of the first author (https://scholar.google.com/citations?view_op=list_works&hl=e...).

Re: Long-Term Cannabis Use, Cognitive Decline, and the Hippocampus

#15

Post by jamal-kumar » Fri, Mar 10, 2023, 2:38 PM UTC

This is pretty important kind of research. Tons of people are using this stuff medically and while it's obviously a better solution for pain management than long-term use of things that can kill you if they're suddenly unavailable, like opiates, we should still be highly aware of mitigating whatever harms could come from the widely used alternatives. It would also be more interesting to see harm in aspects of things like hippocampal density compared to pain medication than compared to regular alcohol or other recreational substance use. I kind of feel it's unlikely at this point but it could just turn out that people who are prone to losing IQ points faster like to consume more cannabis as well and it's not as much of a causative agent. I would imagine the first thing I want after getting smacked in the head by someone if this was something I did professionally is something to take the pain away. This study could also just be a crock of shit like some others are saying but I don't really feel qualified to judge that.

The only thing that can truly tell with these kinds of studies is another 30 years of data.

Re: Long-Term Cannabis Use, Cognitive Decline, and the Hippocampus

#16

Post by newsclues » Fri, Mar 10, 2023, 2:38 PM UTC

fallingknife wrote: post #7

I smoked weed constantly in college, and when I stopped, it was like a fog lifted. Its danger was comically exaggerated in the anti-drug propaganda they force fed to kids in the US for so long that a lot of people have a reactionary tendency to assume it's harmless, but they will soon be proven wrong. Still has nothing on America's number 1 hard drug, alcohol, though.

I've found it's possible to get high every night, and be clear headed and functional in the morning.

A weekend of heavy smoking and edibles can leave me feeling a bit sluggish on Monday. But also refreshed for the rest of the week.

Re: Long-Term Cannabis Use, Cognitive Decline, and the Hippocampus

#17

Post by runlaszlorun » Fri, Mar 10, 2023, 2:39 PM UTC

AnEro wrote: post #13

I also wonder what their lifestyles are in general, and if it would have an effect. I feel like weed puts my brain into autopilot to a degree and makes me 'okay' with w/e I am doing. So recreational usage I could see making you 'dumber' cause weed lets you feel okay doing nothing and doing nothing is a good way to be dumber My anecdotal opinion for someone that smokes a lot compared to their long-term cannabis users,…

> anything worth doing is worth doing poorly

Ha! That’s great line.

Re: Long-Term Cannabis Use, Cognitive Decline, and the Hippocampus

#18

Post by SamoyedFurFluff » Fri, Mar 10, 2023, 2:41 PM UTC

varispeed wrote: post #4

AlanYx wrote: post #2

What's most interesting about this article IMHO is that these results were found with "long-term cannabis users" defined as those who use "typically 1-4 times weekly". That seems like relatively casual use.

Author obviously has a conflict of interest. He fails to acknowledge that correlation is not causation and that these studies fail to take into account other variables that could influence the outcomes.

I don’t think you’re using conflict of interest correctly. You’re saying here the author has secondary motives, such as being sponsored by an anti-weed org or something, which they would have to disclose in their own section (as per basic academic standards).

You might want to instead if you want to criticize the research say the authors clearly have a personal agenda or bias.

Re: Long-Term Cannabis Use, Cognitive Decline, and the Hippocampus

#19

Post by troydavis » Fri, Mar 10, 2023, 2:42 PM UTC

Clent wrote: post #10

This is not a primary source of anything related to psychology. This site is article marketing for people in the mental health field. The primary motivation of the author's is to self promotion.

Here's the full text of the paper it's covering (cited as footnote 4):

"Long-term Cannabis Users Show Lower Cognitive Reserves and Smaller Hippocampal Volume in Midlife": https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9426660/

Re: Long-Term Cannabis Use, Cognitive Decline, and the Hippocampus

#20

Post by legitster » Fri, Mar 10, 2023, 2:43 PM UTC

AlanYx wrote: post #2

What's most interesting about this article IMHO is that these results were found with "long-term cannabis users" defined as those who use "typically 1-4 times weekly". That seems like relatively casual use.

It's pretty shocking how many people I know who are essentially high 24/7.