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Stop developing this technology

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Re: Stop developing this technology

#11

Post by yipbub »

I'm convinced that this idea that technology is completely neutral is wrong. It is not neutral in the face of human psychology. The human species is a different animal that the human individual, and it is powerful, but does not make truly conscious decisions.

Once you let the genie out of the bottle, a wish will be made. A technology might not be inherently bad, but neither are knives, and we don't leave those lying around.

That said, it is the human species that develops technology, rarely is one human individual capable of holding back a technology.

Re: Stop developing this technology

#12

Post by Rimintil »

blondin wrote: post #2

haven't paid much attention to the deepfake community. but this one is debatable. one of their linked forums has a section for flagging uncredited videos or work. so, deepfake authors want credits for their work. that's perplexing. what's more, this is happening while they seem to be ignoring the ethical concerns raised in the issue. citing that people can do whatever they want with the tech.

Technology like this has blown up on Twitch/Twitch circles within the past couple of days (I won't link to it due to the sexual nature, but you can find references on /r/livestreamfail). Men taking women's [Twitch streamers] faces and use your imagination from there.

Completely inappropriate and unethical.

What value does this technology add? Bringing Princess Leia back to another Star Wars movie? Anything more than that?

Re: Stop developing this technology

#14

Post by pfortuny »

jolmg wrote: post #5
jakelazaroff wrote: post #3

Regardless of what I think about this technology in particular, I want to respond to this line from the second comment: [1] > on the contrary, it must be developed. No, it mustn’t. There’s not a gun to your head, forcing you to do this. You want to develop this technology. That’s why it’s happening. Technology isn’t inevitable. It’s a choice we make. And we can go in circles about whether it’s good or bad, but at lea…

"must" is probably the wrong word, but if they don't develop it, someone else will. At most, it would be delayed, and I'm not sure there's much difference in that.

Right. Tell that to Einstein, who just before Hiroshima realized it was not such a good argument.

That is a nice piece of history.

Ethics is important. And one consequence is: I may die but at least it was not because I made it possible.

Re: Stop developing this technology

#15

Post by jolmg »

jakelazaroff wrote: post #10
jolmg wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"must" is probably the wrong word, but if they don't develop it, someone else will. At most, it would be delayed, and I'm not sure there's much difference in that.

Can we agree that “someone would have done this anyway” is a poor justification for one’s actions? That’s what you say when you 1) recognize that you did a bad thing, but 2) don’t want to be blamed for it.

Can we agree that it's fundamentally not a bad thing to develop a technology? If you were a legislator, how would you like to criminalize the development of technology?

You know, the most difficult part of this tech is probably the facial tracking, which is probably also used for the animation of 3d avatars. The jump is probably not huge.

Re: Stop developing this technology

#16

Post by MattRix »

jolmg wrote: post #15
jakelazaroff wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can we agree that “someone would have done this anyway” is a poor justification for one’s actions? That’s what you say when you 1) recognize that you did a bad thing, but 2) don’t want to be blamed for it.

Can we agree that it's fundamentally not a bad thing to develop a technology? If you were a legislator, how would you like to criminalize the development of technology? You know, the most difficult part of this tech is probably the facial tracking, which is probably also used for the animation of 3d avatars. The jump is probably not huge.

Many things can be unethical/immoral without being illegal, and of course there are some technologies that are fundamentally bad.

Re: Stop developing this technology

#17

Post by number6 »

ano88888 wrote: post #8
Lacerda69 wrote: post #4

an age old discussion. ultimately i prefer for this technology to be developed in the open on github and be aware of it (and able to combat nefarious use of it). the alternative is that its being developed hidden and used by the most vile and evil without many being aware of it (which it most definitely will) As with nuclear, the cats out of the bag or the babys bathwater(?) already spilled, no way to turn back the c…

now that it is in the open , any high school boy can create some porn deepfakes of their classmates and suicide rate will probably rise. Let's see if you still hold this view when one of your family members is a victim

We are lifing just fine with car related deaths. The rate is much higher than suicide rates.

Bullying is alive and well even without this tech. I guess scissoring out a photo from the yearbook and glue it in a porn magazine would work as good. It is not about believability but about the psychological damage when it comes to bullying

Re: Stop developing this technology

#18

Post by cwillu »

jakelazaroff wrote: post #3

Regardless of what I think about this technology in particular, I want to respond to this line from the second comment: [1] > on the contrary, it must be developed. No, it mustn’t. There’s not a gun to your head, forcing you to do this. You want to develop this technology. That’s why it’s happening. Technology isn’t inevitable. It’s a choice we make. And we can go in circles about whether it’s good or bad, but at lea…

From the main page: “Communication groups [...] • mrdeepfakes - the biggest NSFW English deepfake community”, which strains my assumption of good faith debate regarding their ethics.

Re: Stop developing this technology

#19

Post by cwillu »

Rimintil wrote: post #12
blondin wrote: post #2

haven't paid much attention to the deepfake community. but this one is debatable. one of their linked forums has a section for flagging uncredited videos or work. so, deepfake authors want credits for their work. that's perplexing. what's more, this is happening while they seem to be ignoring the ethical concerns raised in the issue. citing that people can do whatever they want with the tech.

Technology like this has blown up on Twitch/Twitch circles within the past couple of days (I won't link to it due to the sexual nature, but you can find references on /r/livestreamfail). Men taking women's [Twitch streamers] faces and use your imagination from there. Completely inappropriate and unethical. What value does this technology add? Bringing Princess Leia back to another Star Wars movie? Anything more than…

You don't have to use your imagination, they proudly list “mrdeepfakes - the biggest NSFW English deepfake community” in the repo's readme.

Re: Stop developing this technology

#20

Post by prox »

jakelazaroff wrote: post #10
jolmg wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"must" is probably the wrong word, but if they don't develop it, someone else will. At most, it would be delayed, and I'm not sure there's much difference in that.

Can we agree that “someone would have done this anyway” is a poor justification for one’s actions? That’s what you say when you 1) recognize that you did a bad thing, but 2) don’t want to be blamed for it.

It’s simply that it’s a kids/teen level argument. “But they did it too!”

Not a lot of thought went into it, is what it usually tells me.

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