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Occupy Portland's Dec 3rd Tactic to Neutralize Police

portlandoccupier.org

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Re: Occupy Portland's Dec 3rd Tactic to Neutralize Police

#11

Post by tptacek »

So here's HN in 2012: the Hiring Thread, which leads this month with a chorus of comments about how effective HN has been for finding people awesome jobs or companies awesome candidates, is at the bottom of the front page just a few hours after submission.

Meanwhile, "Occupy Portland's Dec 3rd Tactic to Neutralize Police" is at the top.

It's unsurprising. The kinds of people who are interested in Occupy protest tactics are very vociferously interested. The kinds of people who are interested in the hiring thread aren't nearly as engaged with that topic (or, those who are aren't numerous). "Real", on-topic HN threads are at a systemic disadvantage to advocacy topics like Occupy.

Flagged, for whatever good that will do.

Re: Occupy Portland's Dec 3rd Tactic to Neutralize Police

#12

Post by jfoster »

Anechoic wrote: post #7

"Get the music blaring [...]" This piece of advice will get people fined (and possibly arrested) for violating noise ordinances in many municipalities. You're better off marching silently.

If you're particularly worried about getting fined/arrested, then blocking traffic is also going to be a problem.

Re: Occupy Portland's Dec 3rd Tactic to Neutralize Police

#13

Post by colonelxc »

Anechoic wrote: post #7

"Get the music blaring [...]" This piece of advice will get people fined (and possibly arrested) for violating noise ordinances in many municipalities. You're better off marching silently.

The police were already announcing that people marching through the streets and blocking traffic were going to be arrested anyway, so it's not like marching silently would save them from the threat of arrest.

Re: Occupy Portland's Dec 3rd Tactic to Neutralize Police

#14

Post by mhartl »

The military analogy is broken. The hack isn't to use the superiority of "light infantry" over "heavy infantry", etc. The reason the protestors can "take a park" even when the police oppose them is because they operate in a political system where the police can't fire on crowds. You probably think this is always a good thing. That's the hack.

Re: Occupy Portland's Dec 3rd Tactic to Neutralize Police

#15

Post by mhartl »

tptacek wrote: post #11

So here's HN in 2012: the Hiring Thread, which leads this month with a chorus of comments about how effective HN has been for finding people awesome jobs or companies awesome candidates, is at the bottom of the front page just a few hours after submission. Meanwhile, "Occupy Portland's Dec 3rd Tactic to Neutralize Police" is at the top. It's unsurprising. The kinds of people who are interested in Occupy protest tacti…

I almost flagged this, too, but the article kind of describes a hack. I agree that it's marginal, though, and I could go either way on this one.

Re: Occupy Portland's Dec 3rd Tactic to Neutralize Police

#16

Post by brown9-2 »

tptacek wrote: post #11

So here's HN in 2012: the Hiring Thread, which leads this month with a chorus of comments about how effective HN has been for finding people awesome jobs or companies awesome candidates, is at the bottom of the front page just a few hours after submission. Meanwhile, "Occupy Portland's Dec 3rd Tactic to Neutralize Police" is at the top. It's unsurprising. The kinds of people who are interested in Occupy protest tacti…

Perhaps it's just that one submission is five times older than the other, as of this comment.

Re: Occupy Portland's Dec 3rd Tactic to Neutralize Police

#17

Post by blurbytree »

tptacek wrote: post #11

So here's HN in 2012: the Hiring Thread, which leads this month with a chorus of comments about how effective HN has been for finding people awesome jobs or companies awesome candidates, is at the bottom of the front page just a few hours after submission. Meanwhile, "Occupy Portland's Dec 3rd Tactic to Neutralize Police" is at the top. It's unsurprising. The kinds of people who are interested in Occupy protest tacti…

As t→∞, HN→Reddit

Re: Occupy Portland's Dec 3rd Tactic to Neutralize Police

#18

Post by calibraxis »

christkv wrote: post #3
nameless_noob wrote: post #2

What drew me to this article was it's discussion of the tactics a unorganized group can do and try all at once. A neat superposition of several topics. Like a glorified case of the wisdom of crowds.

unfortunately any mass movement is dependent on being able to apply political pressure. It might work if there is a growing momentum and you end up with an 'orange' revolution. Most likely it's going to simply die out by itself unless it can actually transform into a political force. Being in Spain I can tell you the protests accomplished nothing, changed nothing politically and ended up dissolving themselves once it…

Yes, I personally think that if these Occupy movements result in organizing long-term institutions which help people, then they're successful. Lurid riot porn is not a victory condition.

One problem is the attitude mentioned in the article: "This has been a show of bravado that has the tactical benefits of providing media coverage of the brutal methods of police and the benefit of draining the resources of the oppressor by forcing them to incur the expense of arresting and prosecuting people for trivial offenses." (Keep in mind that the US imprisons its populace far more than any other nation, so this is no joke.) I read this rebuttal recently:

"Getting arrested as an unavoidable consequence of standing up for a cause is noble; getting arrested as a voluntary, symbolic act is widely considered bizarre, at best. Moreover, it frustrates huge sectors of the movement who see an opportunity cost to the resources that go into unnecessary jail support, bail, and legal costs. Perhaps worst of all, voluntary arrest is seen by members of especially targeted communities as flaunting arrestees’ race and class privilege."

(http://www.zcommunications.org/pacifism-and-diversity-of-tac...)

Re: Occupy Portland's Dec 3rd Tactic to Neutralize Police

#19

Post by neilk »

graupel wrote: post #4

Sounds like the way Critical Mass (cycling) rides in Chicago work - with no pre-set route the police join in and make sure no one gets hurt but they can't really push the ride in one direction or another - the 'hive' decides where to go. With 5,000 to 10,000 people it's a pretty huge event/example.

That's not specific to Chicago. All Critical Mass rides work that way.
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