This just looks like a frontend over kubernetes.
Imperative configs are out; Declarative configs are in
11–20 of 94 posts
Re: Imperative configs are out; Declarative configs are in
#12>My dad switched from working with a map printout without knowing real-time conditions, the imperative flow, to Google Maps with turn-by-turn directions, the declarative flow.
LOL, he got it backwards, "turn-by-turn directions" is the imperative flow. Can't expect much after reading that.
Re: Imperative configs are out; Declarative configs are in
#13>My dad switched from working with a map printout without knowing real-time conditions, the imperative flow, to Google Maps with turn-by-turn directions, the declarative flow. LOL, he got it backwards, "turn-by-turn directions" is the imperative flow. Can't expect much after reading that.
I was thinking the same thing, but his point is that with Google Maps you simply declare your end goal. It figures out how you should get there based on current conditions.
Re: Imperative configs are out; Declarative configs are in
#14"My dad switched from working with a map printout without knowing real-time conditions, the imperative flow, to Google Maps with turn-by-turn directions, the declarative flow." There is no such thing as an imperative or declarative "flow". By its very definition, declarative does not have "flow". It is just a statement. Imperative (in programming) literally means "describing steps that change state". Declarative (in…
Indeed. Reading SICP should be a requirement for starting a YAML company.
Re: Imperative configs are out; Declarative configs are in
#15"My dad switched from working with a map printout without knowing real-time conditions, the imperative flow, to Google Maps with turn-by-turn directions, the declarative flow." There is no such thing as an imperative or declarative "flow". By its very definition, declarative does not have "flow". It is just a statement. Imperative (in programming) literally means "describing steps that change state". Declarative (in…
> Even when the configuration file "describes a series of steps to change state", it's still declarative, because the configuration file is still declaring to the program how to operate
Not sure I buy that logic. With that reasoning, all code is declarative because it's "declaring to the interpreter/compiler" how to operate.
I think he's making the same point you did. In one case, the config file is laying out a sequence of steps like you did for how to make a burger (imperative). In the second case, the file just defines the end state (declarative).
Sure, you could say that the first case is declarative because the "end state" being defined is pipeline itself. But the point is that we're talking about how to get a burger, not define how to make one.
Re: Imperative configs are out; Declarative configs are in
#16>My dad switched from working with a map printout without knowing real-time conditions, the imperative flow, to Google Maps with turn-by-turn directions, the declarative flow. LOL, he got it backwards, "turn-by-turn directions" is the imperative flow. Can't expect much after reading that.
I was thinking the same thing, but his point is that with Google Maps you simply declare your end goal. It figures out how you should get there based on current conditions.
I guess I should have said "voice-guided" turn-by-turn huh? https://www.forbes.com/sites/anthonykosner/2012/12/13/google... is what i was referring to :)
Re: Imperative configs are out; Declarative configs are in
#17> If a pipeline fails halfway, most CD systems don’t have the ability to retry. The only option is to restart a pipeline from the very beginning. Now with declarative configs, an intelligent delivery system, the system will detect that staging is already on the desired version and skip that push, allowing you to deliver value to your customers faster.
Hey, an interrupted "make" can always restarted from where it left off without ever having to do a "make clean", so what could go wrong.
Re: Imperative configs are out; Declarative configs are in
#18"My dad switched from working with a map printout without knowing real-time conditions, the imperative flow, to Google Maps with turn-by-turn directions, the declarative flow." There is no such thing as an imperative or declarative "flow". By its very definition, declarative does not have "flow". It is just a statement. Imperative (in programming) literally means "describing steps that change state". Declarative (in…
> Even when the configuration file "describes a series of steps to change state", it's still declarative, because the configuration file is still declaring to the program how to operate Not sure I buy that logic. With that reasoning, all code is declarative because it's "declaring to the interpreter/compiler" how to operate. I think he's making the same point you did. In one case, the config file is laying out a sequ…
yep!
Re: Imperative configs are out; Declarative configs are in
#19This just looks like a frontend over kubernetes.
Not exactly? Kubernetes natively doesn’t have a solution for pushing across environments afaik.
Re: Imperative configs are out; Declarative configs are in
#20"My dad switched from working with a map printout without knowing real-time conditions, the imperative flow, to Google Maps with turn-by-turn directions, the declarative flow." There is no such thing as an imperative or declarative "flow". By its very definition, declarative does not have "flow". It is just a statement. Imperative (in programming) literally means "describing steps that change state". Declarative (in…
> Even when the configuration file "describes a series of steps to change state", it's still declarative, because the configuration file is still declaring to the program how to operate Not sure I buy that logic. With that reasoning, all code is declarative because it's "declaring to the interpreter/compiler" how to operate. I think he's making the same point you did. In one case, the config file is laying out a sequ…
> With that reasoning, all code is declarative because it's "declaring to the interpreter/compiler" how to operate.
Sort of! All code is also imperative, eventually, at the machine code level. This is a perfect example of how useless the whole "imperative vs declarative" distinction is. Nearly everything in a computer is both imperative and declarative, in some fashion, at some point.
These terms were not made to be some concrete and inviolable paradigm of computing. Some academics just wanted to tell people to write programs where you didn't have to spell out every instruction to the compiler, so they made this crude distinction. Things like a function called give_me_a_temporary_file(), rather than writing out an entire function yourself to create and return a temporary file. But both are executing steps imperatively under the hood. So we shouldn't make a big deal about these terms or programs that do more of one or the other.
The differences that I'm pointing out are 1) declarative does not describe a flow, the flow is under the hood; and 2) configuration files do not actually perform steps, they merely describe arbitrary data, and only the program interpreting the configuration can determine if the result is imperative or declarative. For some programs, the exact same configuration file may result in either imperative or declarative execution.