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Launch HN: Shimmer (YC S21) – ADHD coaching for adults

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Re: Launch HN: Shimmer (YC S21) – ADHD coaching for adults

#11

Post by Lionga »

samstave wrote: post #7

I have severe ADHD, but I have paid THOUSANDS to therapists and honestly - I NEVER got any benefit from it other than more stress from having to pay so much money for something out-of-pocket. My ADHD has cost me a lot more than money, but what specifically, or HOW specifically is your therapy different than the therapists I have already spent $$$$ on?

It does not because there is no coaching that fixes ADHD. It's almost like they are offering coaching for cancer. Just not going to work and taking advantage of vulnerable.

Re: Launch HN: Shimmer (YC S21) – ADHD coaching for adults

#12

Post by christalwang »

endisneigh wrote: post #5

I like the site but it seems overpriced - a good therapist is cheaper and can do the same thing. A psychologist and psychiatrist can both clinically diagnose you and give you pharmaceuticals if needed at prices similar to the ones mentioned if you have insurance. Personally I would argue from working with some kids who have adhd in the past that more gamification and reasons to use their phone will exacerbate some of…

Thanks for the kind words on our site!

We're definitely aligned / agree that it's really hard to get affordable care. Unfortunately, we've found that our members have tried (but haven't succeeded) in finding a good therapist who is ADHD-informed and can do the specific things they are looking for in regards to coaching. Additionally, we definitely acknowledge that we provide a completely different service than psychologists / psychiatrists, and we work hand in hand with them post diagnosis. We do not offer diagnostics or pharmaceuticals and rely on other medical professionals externally to do so.

Also agree on not using gamification to worsen symptoms. That's something we consider very deeply with our clinical team to ensure we don't exacerbate our relationships to our phone. I'm personally a client on our platform and have that in mind constantly!

Thank you so much for the good luck!

Re: Launch HN: Shimmer (YC S21) – ADHD coaching for adults

#13

Post by endisneigh »

Lionga wrote: post #11
samstave wrote: post #7

I have severe ADHD, but I have paid THOUSANDS to therapists and honestly - I NEVER got any benefit from it other than more stress from having to pay so much money for something out-of-pocket. My ADHD has cost me a lot more than money, but what specifically, or HOW specifically is your therapy different than the therapists I have already spent $$$$ on?

It does not because there is no coaching that fixes ADHD. It's almost like they are offering coaching for cancer. Just not going to work and taking advantage of vulnerable.

Though I do agree with your point, the symptoms of adhd can be managed with lifestyle changes

Re: Launch HN: Shimmer (YC S21) – ADHD coaching for adults

#14

Post by elil17 »

cauthon wrote: post #2

Why do you describe your product as "coaching", and not "therapy"? Is this a marketing decision because of a perceived stigma around the term "therapy"? (The re-branding of CBT/ACT to "coaching" and "training" instead of "therapy" strikes me as odd, I don't understand the emphasis on avoiding the term.) Will your company be accepting medical insurance? $350/mo (~$90/session) is roughly half of what billed-to-insuranc…

From their website: We’re looking for licensed coaches (ICF or NBHWC preferred) or licensed mental health professionals (e.g., PhD, PsyD, LCSW, LMFT, etc.) specializing in ADHD.

Looks like they accept people with coaching licenses (this often means less than 200 hours of training).

My understanding is that coaches are typically qualified to work with people who don't have acute mental health needs. For example a coach might help someone figure out how to eat healthier, but wouldn't be qualified to treat an eating disorder.

Re: Launch HN: Shimmer (YC S21) – ADHD coaching for adults

#15

Post by cauthon »

christalwang wrote: post #8
cauthon wrote: post #2

Why do you describe your product as "coaching", and not "therapy"? Is this a marketing decision because of a perceived stigma around the term "therapy"? (The re-branding of CBT/ACT to "coaching" and "training" instead of "therapy" strikes me as odd, I don't understand the emphasis on avoiding the term.) Will your company be accepting medical insurance? $350/mo (~$90/session) is roughly half of what billed-to-insuranc…

The closest sister discipline our coaches practice is Health & Wellness coaching, but we also draw on the foundations of positive psychology, CBT, etc. depending on the member's situation. The practices of coaching & therapy, although they have some overlap, are largely different in both practice and outcomes. For example, in the context of ADHD, coaching is very focused on future-oriented outcomes and tactic-oriente…

> For example, in the context of ADHD, coaching is very focused on future-oriented outcomes and tactic-oriented skills, whereas therapy is often focused on disentangling thoughts, unpacking trauma, etc

Respectfully, in my experience therapy is very focused on outcomes and skills. (A very short list of examples: CBT's thought records, DBT's DEAR MAN, ACT's defusion.)

Is the distinction pedantic, or does it have more to do with the qualifications or certifications the provider holds?

Re: Launch HN: Shimmer (YC S21) – ADHD coaching for adults

#16

Post by Lionga »

endisneigh wrote: post #13
Lionga wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It does not because there is no coaching that fixes ADHD. It's almost like they are offering coaching for cancer. Just not going to work and taking advantage of vulnerable.

Though I do agree with your point, the symptoms of adhd can be managed with lifestyle changes

Would be very happy to hear your lifestyle changes that manage (what does that mean?) the symptoms. Honestly if they work that would help me an others a lot.

For me the symptoms are loosing around a few ten to hunderd of thousands of dollars a year (maybe even millions) in my work/career. How can my lifestyle changes manage that?

No attack, really really curious.

Re: Launch HN: Shimmer (YC S21) – ADHD coaching for adults

#17

Post by christalwang »

vaishnavsm wrote: post #3

Congrats and good luck on the launch! Ok so in general I'd chalk this up to being disinterested, but I think this is relevant for a product meant for people with ADHD: After a couple pages of choices, I was met with a screen with options A through K, and I instantly closed the tab. I didn't even read what it was asking. I realised that this may literally be ADHD like behaviour, so I opened it back up again, but it wa…

This is really valuable feedback for us as we've iterated on that form with the ADHD community for a while and actually that exact question you're talking about is one that we've debated and changed a few times. I really appreciate your feedback here, let us revisit our notes on that question again, we'll continue to weigh the pros and cons here...

I personally believe from a UX perspective when you can make things simpler for people with ADHD, you make it simpler for all! Basically the premise of docusign :)

Re: Launch HN: Shimmer (YC S21) – ADHD coaching for adults

#20

Post by christalwang »

lambic wrote: post #4

> If you have ADHD (or think you do) Does the "or think you do" mean you perform diagnoses too?

Unfortunately we don't perform diagnoses at this point. We do have some great partners that we refer out to for diagnoses, or we can help support folks through that process.

What we mean by that is we coach people who don't necessarily have a diagnosis. We welcome anyone who wants to come and be coached on ADHD-related skills & goals. For example, if you want to work on your executive function but you don't have an ADHD diagnosis, you're completely welcome here!

This is also because certain cultures (or an array of different circumstances could put someone in this position) prevent folks from getting a timely diagnosis and/or they don't want to tell their parents, etc. But in this case they can still get coaching with less of the stigma. This is a broader challenge/problem in society though that we're barely scratching the surface on.

As a female, queer, BIPOC/AAPI person who grew up in a certain "bubble", I've definitely faced head on how hard it can be to take the first step to diagnosis.

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