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Stop Telling Women To Do Startups

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11–20 of 205 posts

Re: Stop Telling Women To Do Startups

#11
post #7

I think it makes sense to encourage women to consider doing a start up - yes for some women raising a family is the fulfillment that they want. But for those that do want to focus on a career, it's very possible to feel left out. Although (intellectually) you know that there's no reason why if this guy or that guy can do it, you can't - there's something somewhat sobering and potentially disheartening about almost ev…

I agree it's more important that everyone has an opportunity to do something, whether they want to or not -- and if they want to do it, the more help and encouragement the better.

Re: Stop Telling Women To Do Startups

#12

I love Penelope Trunk and her political incorrectness. Her advice may always be controversial, but she's never afraid to speak her mind. And she's right too about women. Their natural imperative is to raise children and nurture them - not to do startups. Most also want the social companionship from friends/family as they raise children (which is missing today as most people don't live near extended family), but they…

> [Women's] natural imperative is to raise children and nurture them

This is the 21st century. Are we really still talking about "natural imperatives"? If nothing else, note that women are having fewer and fewer children, later and later - clearly, they are feeling this "natural imperative" less and less.

Traditional gender roles are unfair to women wanting to have a career, unfair to men who want to stay home with the kids, and far more rigid than needed. Having some "standard patterns" makes sense, but there should be more than one, and the freedom to deviate from those.

Re: Stop Telling Women To Do Startups

#13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If women's natural imperative is to raise children and nurture them, why is Penelope Trunk running a start-up? I really thought that this kind of overly-simplistic "men do X, women do Y" was in the past now, but of course such things never die. There was a time where it was generally believed women should stay at home and worry about the children rather than go to school, or vote. I am sure we will look back on this…

Oh for crying out loud... Everyone on the internet now has to include a disclaimer every time they write a general statement that doesn't apply to 100% of people, but is pretty much true . The majority of women don't do startups - that's empirical evidence right there. There's nothing stopping them of course, and I'm not saying they shouldn't do startups. I'm just observing why I think most don't.

No, there is no need for a disclaimer. This article make very clear that the opinion of Penelope is that the only reason women aren't running more startups is their genetics tells them to settle down, have children, and only run little lifestyle business between having children.

While there certainly is help for women running startups, there is also still sexism at many levels.

There are lots of reasons why women still stay at home and look after the children other than genetics. One of the most obvious ones to me (from personal experience) is that men are looked down on if they are the primary carer for their children.

Re: Stop Telling Women To Do Startups

#14
Actually, I've met a lot of guys who are in high powered positions who have implied or stated explicitly they'd much rather spend more time at home. And these guys have told younger guys, mentees, to pretty much spend more time as dads and husbands. This advice is becoming increasingly common.

So, um yeah, Penelope is pretty much wrong right out of the gate.

Re: Stop Telling Women To Do Startups

#16

I love Penelope Trunk and her political incorrectness. Her advice may always be controversial, but she's never afraid to speak her mind. And she's right too about women. Their natural imperative is to raise children and nurture them - not to do startups. Most also want the social companionship from friends/family as they raise children (which is missing today as most people don't live near extended family), but they…

If women's natural imperative is to raise children and nurture them, why is Penelope Trunk running a start-up? I really thought that this kind of overly-simplistic "men do X, women do Y" was in the past now, but of course such things never die. There was a time where it was generally believed women should stay at home and worry about the children rather than go to school, or vote. I am sure we will look back on this…

"""If women's natural imperative is to raise children and nurture them, why is Penelope Trunk running a start-up?"""

1) She doesn't, as a comment below states.

2) I fail to see how your question makes any sense.

Tendency/Preference etc is not Absolute Law.

For example, a human's natural instinct is survival, yet there are still people willing to sacrifice their lives for others in danger, etc.

(I always hate it when someone takes some statistical observation and thinks it's very smart to point out that there are exceptions --or even worse, uses them to "prove" the statistical observation doesn't hold. Happens all the time in pedantic-land).

"""I really thought that this kind of overly-simplistic "men do X, women do Y" was in the past now, but of course such things never die."""

Overly simplistic? Just because there are counter-examples, and complex cases, doesn't mean that the generalization is overly simplistic.

To make sense of the world you have to generalize, that is not to give equal importance to a multitude of fringe cases.

"""I hope you see the irony in thinking that there is nothing stopping women from running startups, but they shouldn't want to, as women want to stay at home and look after the children."""

Nobody said "shouldn't", she said "wouldn't".

And, statistically speaking, most don't. Do you see equally as many women founders? Or do you think you can attribute that to some mysterious general sexist attitude that prevents them?

Re: Stop Telling Women To Do Startups

#17

I love Penelope Trunk and her political incorrectness. Her advice may always be controversial, but she's never afraid to speak her mind. And she's right too about women. Their natural imperative is to raise children and nurture them - not to do startups. Most also want the social companionship from friends/family as they raise children (which is missing today as most people don't live near extended family), but they…

Their natural imperative is to raise children and nurture them - not to do startups.

[citation needed]

There is no evidence that women naturally want to only raise children. And the implication that a woman who doesn't want spend all their life at home is a 'unnatural' woman, and there is something wrong with her, is a terribly, false, harmful meme to spread.

I find this comment offensive, since it spreads a meme that's completly against the Hacker ethic, which values meritocracy above pety ideas like gender, race etc. I'm flagging this comment.

Re: Stop Telling Women To Do Startups

#18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If women's natural imperative is to raise children and nurture them, why is Penelope Trunk running a start-up? I really thought that this kind of overly-simplistic "men do X, women do Y" was in the past now, but of course such things never die. There was a time where it was generally believed women should stay at home and worry about the children rather than go to school, or vote. I am sure we will look back on this…

Oh for crying out loud... Everyone on the internet now has to include a disclaimer every time they write a general statement that doesn't apply to 100% of people, but is pretty much true . The majority of women don't do startups - that's empirical evidence right there. There's nothing stopping them of course, and I'm not saying they shouldn't do startups. I'm just observing why I think most don't.

There's nothing stopping them of course

Institutial misogyny?

Re: Stop Telling Women To Do Startups

#19

I love Penelope Trunk and her political incorrectness. Her advice may always be controversial, but she's never afraid to speak her mind. And she's right too about women. Their natural imperative is to raise children and nurture them - not to do startups. Most also want the social companionship from friends/family as they raise children (which is missing today as most people don't live near extended family), but they…

This might have been just a poor choice of words, but beware the naturalistic fallacy.

Trunk believes that more women are choosing not to do startups. That's not exactly the same thing as saying it's their "natural imperative". Because then those who choose otherwise are being "unnatural".

Also, the "natural imperative" thing implies that our current state of affairs is somehow the only possibility. Maybe the way investment works is currently broken somehow.

Re: Stop Telling Women To Do Startups

#20
post #4

I think she made some very good points. It was a bit ranty, and self contradictory at times: >On top of that there is evidence that the members of the VC community go out of their way to attract women. Of course, this makes sense. VCs look for underserved markets. Women are likely to address different markets than men, and since there are so few women founders compared to men founders, it’s likely that women are addr…

Yes. What's a startup business, or even a traditional career, going to get you in the end? Admiration? Adulation? Money money money?

As most people with children will be able to tell you, all of those things are vapid and empty compared to spending time with your children. Perhaps many women choosing to stay home raising families instead of pursuing careers have found something more rewarding to do with their time.

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