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SQLite Code of Ethics (2020)

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Re: SQLite Code of Ethics (2020)

#11

Post by threatofrain »

tptacek wrote: post #10
chrsig wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

100x this the rule excludes me from participating in development -- i.e., I refuse to dread Hell, or let that dread dictate my actions. I can treat others well without the threat of eternal damnation. The dread of hell only detracts from my life. The Rule also precludes any non-christian contributors. Charlemagne's world was much smaller and simpler than ours. It's ok to give the list a refresh.

According to Hipp, the rule does no such thing.

And do we know if there has ever been a single exception to this rule in practice? The CoC as written is a religious covenant between all current developers and its users.

Again, if we explore the hypothetical of the same scenario but with another company, do you truly find no suspicion over the actual reality of religious inclusion if it appears there isn't a single exception to their unanimous religious pledge?

Maybe I'm just confused over the wording and there are current exceptions, and perhaps you might have some off the top of your head already.

Re: SQLite Code of Ethics (2020)

#12

Post by tptacek »

threatofrain wrote: post #11
tptacek wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

According to Hipp, the rule does no such thing.

And do we know if there has ever been a single exception to this rule in practice? The CoC as written is a religious covenant between all current developers and its users. Again, if we explore the hypothetical of the same scenario but with another company, do you truly find no suspicion over the actual reality of religious inclusion if it appears there isn't a single exception to their unanimous religious pledge? May…

It's right there in the plain language of the SQLite page, in addition to Hipp himself confirming it in an interview. I think you have to want this to be sinister to read it that way.

About the grumpiest you can reasonably get about this is that Hipp is making a statement about codes of conduct.

Re: SQLite Code of Ethics (2020)

#13

Post by chrsig »

tptacek wrote: post #12
threatofrain wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And do we know if there has ever been a single exception to this rule in practice? The CoC as written is a religious covenant between all current developers and its users. Again, if we explore the hypothetical of the same scenario but with another company, do you truly find no suspicion over the actual reality of religious inclusion if it appears there isn't a single exception to their unanimous religious pledge? May…

It's right there in the plain language of the SQLite page, in addition to Hipp himself confirming it in an interview. I think you have to want this to be sinister to read it that way. About the grumpiest you can reasonably get about this is that Hipp is making a statement about codes of conduct.

Personally, I'm not grumpy about anything. Disappointed, perhaps, at worst, because it's grounded in christianity.

I don't see what you're referring to regarding plain language -- would you be so kind as to provide the quote from the document?

The two sentences that lead me to believe that the document applies to all contributors are:

> The founder of SQLite and all current developers have pledged to follow the spirit of The Rule to the best of their ability.

> They view The Rule as their promise to all SQLite users of how the developers are expected to behave.

Granted, it only refers to current developers, but if they view it as a promise for "how the developers are expected to behave", that indicates to me that future contributors would be held to it as a standard.

Of which is their right -- it's their project and they can determine who they want contributions from just as much as any other project. But it lacking any statement to the contrary, it certainly seems like religious belief is one of the bases on which contributors are judged.

Re: SQLite Code of Ethics (2020)

#14

Post by tptacek »

chrsig wrote: post #13
tptacek wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's right there in the plain language of the SQLite page, in addition to Hipp himself confirming it in an interview. I think you have to want this to be sinister to read it that way. About the grumpiest you can reasonably get about this is that Hipp is making a statement about codes of conduct.

Personally, I'm not grumpy about anything. Disappointed, perhaps, at worst, because it's grounded in christianity. I don't see what you're referring to regarding plain language -- would you be so kind as to provide the quote from the document? The two sentences that lead me to believe that the document applies to all contributors are: > The founder of SQLite and all current developers have pledged to follow the spiri…

This page does not say that current developers of SQLite all adhere to Christian religious practice.

Re: SQLite Code of Ethics (2020)

#15

Post by chrsig »

tptacek wrote: post #14
chrsig wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Personally, I'm not grumpy about anything. Disappointed, perhaps, at worst, because it's grounded in christianity. I don't see what you're referring to regarding plain language -- would you be so kind as to provide the quote from the document? The two sentences that lead me to believe that the document applies to all contributors are: > The founder of SQLite and all current developers have pledged to follow the spiri…

This page does not say that current developers of SQLite all adhere to Christian religious practice.

I didn't suggest anything about the developers religious practices. Would you be more clear on the point you're trying to make?

Re: SQLite Code of Ethics (2020)

#16

Post by threatofrain »

tptacek wrote: post #14
chrsig wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Personally, I'm not grumpy about anything. Disappointed, perhaps, at worst, because it's grounded in christianity. I don't see what you're referring to regarding plain language -- would you be so kind as to provide the quote from the document? The two sentences that lead me to believe that the document applies to all contributors are: > The founder of SQLite and all current developers have pledged to follow the spiri…

This page does not say that current developers of SQLite all adhere to Christian religious practice.

It really does read that way. But if you say that the ground reality is different then perhaps the CoC is just out of date. The CoC says all current developers make this pledge, and that this is a covenant between developers and users.
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