Live data from Hacker News

Folk Interfaces

maggieappleton.com

11–20 of 103 posts

Re: Folk Interfaces

#11

> No matter how much well-intentioned user research these companies invest in, they'll never be able to produce software that fully meets the needs of individual users and culturally distant communities. Domain experts being able to solve their own problems sounds is a worthwhile objective for software tools but innovation in this space has been surprisingly sparce. I've been searching for other examples of end-user…

People using notepad to subtitle screen-captured tutorials on Youtube.

Re: Folk Interfaces

#12
The biggest issue that I come across, is users of my software, developing mental models of the software that I would never, in a million years, have developed, myself.

They often work with the software, based on their "strange" mental model, and can have very weird workflows.

In some cases, this is excellent, and it is worth it for me to learn the new model, and maybe add affordances for it.

Re: Folk Interfaces

#13

The biggest issue that I come across, is users of my software, developing mental models of the software that I would never, in a million years, have developed, myself. They often work with the software, based on their "strange" mental model, and can have very weird workflows. In some cases, this is excellent, and it is worth it for me to learn the new model, and maybe add affordances for it.

Could you talk about some concrete examples?

Re: Folk Interfaces

#14

> No matter how much well-intentioned user research these companies invest in, they'll never be able to produce software that fully meets the needs of individual users and culturally distant communities. Domain experts being able to solve their own problems sounds is a worthwhile objective for software tools but innovation in this space has been surprisingly sparce. I've been searching for other examples of end-user…

Hypercard was this and generated really rich "folk" artefacts. Filemaker (https://www.claris.com) is sort of this still. A modern example is Coda (https://coda.io) which is seeks to be spreadsheet like in terms of inviting folk (end users) to play and create while making database and scripting easy enough to discover and wrangle.

Re: Folk Interfaces

#15
post #11

> No matter how much well-intentioned user research these companies invest in, they'll never be able to produce software that fully meets the needs of individual users and culturally distant communities. Domain experts being able to solve their own problems sounds is a worthwhile objective for software tools but innovation in this space has been surprisingly sparce. I've been searching for other examples of end-user…

People using notepad to subtitle screen-captured tutorials on Youtube.

As cringey as that looks, what are other options there? Windows' desktop (and neither Linux's IIRC) doesn't have a built-in "stick-it note" functionality — which is kind of a shame if you really think about it.

Re: Folk Interfaces

#16

The biggest issue that I come across, is users of my software, developing mental models of the software that I would never, in a million years, have developed, myself. They often work with the software, based on their "strange" mental model, and can have very weird workflows. In some cases, this is excellent, and it is worth it for me to learn the new model, and maybe add affordances for it.

One example for me is iMovie on macOS. They dedicate 50% of the screen to a sort of “project media library” where you put all videos and audio you want to use in your project and that also holds all titles, transitions etc. you can add.

Literally everyone I ever see using this software drags videos directly from the finder onto the timeline, then pick a transition once and then just copy/paste it within the timeline. So 50% of the screen is wasted real estate for a lot of the users.

Re: Folk Interfaces

#17
Folk interfaces are a natural consequence of the focus on building applications for millions of users and the dearth of situated software [1]. They're also a clever way of claiming no-code or low-code platforms in unexpected places.

[1]: https://www.gwern.net/docs/technology/2004-03-30-shirky-situ...

Re: Folk Interfaces

#18

The biggest issue that I come across, is users of my software, developing mental models of the software that I would never, in a million years, have developed, myself. They often work with the software, based on their "strange" mental model, and can have very weird workflows. In some cases, this is excellent, and it is worth it for me to learn the new model, and maybe add affordances for it.

Could you talk about some concrete examples?

Gimme a bit. I’m going to have to come up with examples that don’t compromise any proprietary information. Most of the examples are from my work for a photography equipment manufacturer, and they wouldn’t want me to talk about it.

Re: Folk Interfaces

#19

The biggest issue that I come across, is users of my software, developing mental models of the software that I would never, in a million years, have developed, myself. They often work with the software, based on their "strange" mental model, and can have very weird workflows. In some cases, this is excellent, and it is worth it for me to learn the new model, and maybe add affordances for it.

Could you talk about some concrete examples?

Git is a pile of patches!

Re: Folk Interfaces

#20

The biggest issue that I come across, is users of my software, developing mental models of the software that I would never, in a million years, have developed, myself. They often work with the software, based on their "strange" mental model, and can have very weird workflows. In some cases, this is excellent, and it is worth it for me to learn the new model, and maybe add affordances for it.

My favourite XKCD "Workflow" [0] is very relevant here.

Unfortunately, because people function that way, there's a lot of pain ahead for those to learn to rely of obscure uses of software. Sooner or later those pathways are dropped, if for no other reason than cutting down on maintenance costs.

https://xkcd.com/1172/

Post reply on HN