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BART’s excursion fare: Agency earns millions from passengers not riding trains

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Re: BART’s excursion fare: Agency earns millions from passengers not riding trains

#11

Post by wsinks »

darth_avocado wrote: post #4

One solution here is that you can actually talk to a bart agent and they provide you with a sticker that you can use to get out without tapping. You show the sticker at the next reentry to get in without tapping again. The problem though, more often than not, the agents are missing from their booths. Also doesn’t help if the exit and reentry are two different stations.

That is definitely the problem. And I've dealt with it by being resilient and having more than one way to use the system. A bit of a pain, but there's only one BART and thankfully most others don't operate this way.

Re: BART’s excursion fare: Agency earns millions from passengers not riding trains

#12

Post by CoffeeOnWrite »

rahimnathwani wrote: post #8
danans wrote: post #5

You can go to the kiosk at any BART station and the station attendant will put a sticker on your card to indicate that you are leaving via the same station you entered and allow you to exit via the emergency doors, therefore not incurring the excursion fare. This is in case you decide not to take the train, or forgot something at home. I suspect the excursion fare today is trying to disincentivize the use of the trai…

The system will have a record of you entering at one station, but no record of an exit. Will that result in a charge or other problem? (On the London Underground, it would result in a charge, as the system is designed to assume you exited somewhere but somehow managed to leave without tapping out.)

You’re correct. When you try to enter next the turnstile will error out with “see agent”. That’s when they fix your card and peel the sticker off. Which highlights the total ridiculousness: they’re asking riders to see an agent twice!

Re: BART’s excursion fare: Agency earns millions from passengers not riding trains

#13

Post by wsinks »

_hhkc wrote: post #2

It's a tax on those that have other transportation options when BART fails

So BART fails, and you decide to leave through the same station. If you just walked through the gates, you get charged ~$7.

But BART failed, so wouldn't there be some instruction? Would you not see the many other people leaving via the emergency gate, which doesn't charge you?

I'm confused on how the same station fare is a tax on people that have other transportation options. I would agree if you said it's a tax on people that accept systems unilaterally.

Re: BART’s excursion fare: Agency earns millions from passengers not riding trains

#14

Post by Glant »

rahimnathwani wrote: post #8
danans wrote: post #5

You can go to the kiosk at any BART station and the station attendant will put a sticker on your card to indicate that you are leaving via the same station you entered and allow you to exit via the emergency doors, therefore not incurring the excursion fare. This is in case you decide not to take the train, or forgot something at home. I suspect the excursion fare today is trying to disincentivize the use of the trai…

The system will have a record of you entering at one station, but no record of an exit. Will that result in a charge or other problem? (On the London Underground, it would result in a charge, as the system is designed to assume you exited somewhere but somehow managed to leave without tapping out.)

Looks like this comment from another chain is your answer https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32442280

Re: BART’s excursion fare: Agency earns millions from passengers not riding trains

#16

Post by CoffeeOnWrite »

darth_avocado wrote: post #4

One solution here is that you can actually talk to a bart agent and they provide you with a sticker that you can use to get out without tapping. You show the sticker at the next reentry to get in without tapping again. The problem though, more often than not, the agents are missing from their booths. Also doesn’t help if the exit and reentry are two different stations.

> You show the sticker at the next reentry to get in without tapping again

I’ve been doing this for years and never seen this. 100% of the time they want to fix the card and peel the sticker off at the outside window, then ask me to tap in at the turnstile.

Re: BART’s excursion fare: Agency earns millions from passengers not riding trains

#17

Post by axit »

danans wrote: post #5

You can go to the kiosk at any BART station and the station attendant will put a sticker on your card to indicate that you are leaving via the same station you entered and allow you to exit via the emergency doors, therefore not incurring the excursion fare. This is in case you decide not to take the train, or forgot something at home. I suspect the excursion fare today is trying to disincentivize the use of the trai…

Usually works but sometimes there's no one at the kiosk.

> I suspect the excursion fare today is trying to disincentivize the use of the trains and stations as shelters by the unhoused.

Time limits around entry exit could be useful here, where you can exit within 10 minutes of entry there is no charge. Reason for exiting at the same station for me is the train is delayed by 30 minutes and I forgot to check the next train before entering the station.

More stories on excursion fare: https://twitter.com/graue/status/1554998671384756229

Re: BART’s excursion fare: Agency earns millions from passengers not riding trains

#18

Post by haunter »

thaumasiotes wrote: post #15

This is a strangely editorialized title. Where did $6.20 come from? The article repeatedly identifies the fee as amounting to $5.75.

Article is from 2017, it has been increased since to $6.20 or $6.40 depending on the page you load

>BART's Excursion Fare is $6.20 (for a Clipper Card) or $6.70 (regular adult paper ticket).

https://www.bart.gov/guide

>The excursion fare set on January 1, 2020 is $6.40 for Clipper and $6.90 for paper tickets.

https://www.bart.gov/tickets

Re: BART’s excursion fare: Agency earns millions from passengers not riding trains

#19

Post by CoffeeOnWrite »

axit wrote: post #17
danans wrote: post #5

You can go to the kiosk at any BART station and the station attendant will put a sticker on your card to indicate that you are leaving via the same station you entered and allow you to exit via the emergency doors, therefore not incurring the excursion fare. This is in case you decide not to take the train, or forgot something at home. I suspect the excursion fare today is trying to disincentivize the use of the trai…

Usually works but sometimes there's no one at the kiosk. > I suspect the excursion fare today is trying to disincentivize the use of the trains and stations as shelters by the unhoused. Time limits around entry exit could be useful here, where you can exit within 10 minutes of entry there is no charge. Reason for exiting at the same station for me is the train is delayed by 30 minutes and I forgot to check the next t…

Neat link. From BART’s tweet response:

> You can request an excursion fare refund with Clipper.

This is true and wasn’t mentioned in the article, but should have been.

Re: BART’s excursion fare: Agency earns millions from passengers not riding trains

#20

Post by jeffbee »

wsinks wrote: post #13
_hhkc wrote: post #2

It's a tax on those that have other transportation options when BART fails

So BART fails, and you decide to leave through the same station. If you just walked through the gates, you get charged ~$7. But BART failed, so wouldn't there be some instruction? Would you not see the many other people leaving via the emergency gate, which doesn't charge you? I'm confused on how the same station fare is a tax on people that have other transportation options. I would agree if you said it's a tax on p…

The problem is that as far as the fare card is concerned you are still "inside" the system until you tap out, so you will not be able to re-enter the system if you leave without tapping out through the emergency gate.
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