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Amazon Engineer Sues for Work from Home Costs

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Re: Amazon Engineer Sues for Work from Home Costs

#11

Post by jacknews »

motive wrote: post #2

My understanding is that California’s language is pretty unambiguous that businesses are responsible for all work expenses. I think on the legal merits the engineer may ultimately prevail, but I just don’t see how this is a battle worth fighting considering the massive savings that work from home already provides. It’s likely a lawsuit like this could also damage one’s long-term career prospects. It will be interesti…

  > My best bet? The Amazon engineer will win.
  > And then he and every other California employee will lose. Here's why.
Exactly as you say, it's not a battle worth fighting, the employee is a fool, or a tool.

Re: Amazon Engineer Sues for Work from Home Costs

#12

Post by esoterica »

mmastrac wrote: post #5

It does raise the question of why large companies _aren't_ responsible for paying for commuting costs. We've obviously never done it that way, but is there a reason that we couldn't?

That means people with cheaper commutes get paid less than people with more expensive commutes. Why would you do that? You’re effectively rewarding people for living further from work and driving less fuel efficient vehicles, which both makes no business sense and is terrible for the environment.

Re: Amazon Engineer Sues for Work from Home Costs

#13

Post by tibbydudeza »

It is possible - my home office is on a separate circuit (own DB board) and I have a electricity consumption monitor on it.

I remember when we went WFH and I was so cheesed over the disruptions in Teams meeting when colleagues used those shitty $10 Chinese made earbuds - asked management to at least supply everybody with a Plantronics headset so we don't waste time.

I was told - we are professionals (we need to buy our own shit) - end of story

Re: Amazon Engineer Sues for Work from Home Costs

#14

Post by candiddevmike »

dbsmith83 wrote: post #9
kodah wrote: post #3

I'm not sure I agree with the article. I'm not even sure that I get corporate logic at this point. Offices cost money, much more money than configuring an enterprise for remote work. There's always that minor percentage of employees who cannot develop successful patterns to work from home. As the pandemic showed, these folks are the minority today. Under this paradigm, as long as remote work costs less than a buildin…

> My personal hypothesis is that companies are doing an organized, long term pull out of offices, but are resisting doing it all at once because they'd impact each other's commercial property values. This confusing state we're in is purposeful. I doubt it, because most companies rent their space and they wouldn't care about the impact to the building. I think your premise is flawed: > There's always that minor percen…

For a lot of companies, they rent from another LLC under the owner's control that owns the building, letting the owner pocket the rent/charge whatever they want for it while building a commercial real estate business.

Re: Amazon Engineer Sues for Work from Home Costs

#15

Post by Jcampuzano2 »

daenz wrote: post #7

The article makes 2 main points: 1) that this lawsuit will cause companies to take WFH away. and 2) It's extremely difficult to bill things like fractional electricity and internet usage. The first is a flimsy premise because companies simply don't have the power to take WFH away and I think they know that. If they did, they would. But the collectivization for WFH, brought by lockdowns, is far too powerful. So powerf…

I used to be one of those people who liked to interact with people face to face. I still do enjoy going to a dedicated space that isn't home and has people to interact with, but I traded going to the office every day with getting a WeWork.

I've seen a bunch of well-known companies now that have office space in WeWork's or similar co-working spaces in lieu of having their own office and wonder if this is a decent alternative to forcing a return to office. It also opened up traveling a bit more since I can go to any location and have reliable internet/space for taking calls.

My own company actually did this and got rid of their San Francisco office and instead renting an office in a WeWork in the area and giving San Francisco area employees a membership.

Re: Amazon Engineer Sues for Work from Home Costs

#16

Post by dijit »

esoterica wrote: post #12
mmastrac wrote: post #5

It does raise the question of why large companies _aren't_ responsible for paying for commuting costs. We've obviously never done it that way, but is there a reason that we couldn't?

That means people with cheaper commutes get paid less than people with more expensive commutes. Why would you do that? You’re effectively rewarding people for living further from work and driving less fuel efficient vehicles, which both makes no business sense and is terrible for the environment.

I think the business doesn't really care where you live.

I have made decisions to live close to my offices, not just for commute but because I consider myself responsible to go in when things break and spending 1.5hrs commuting won't do that.

When I priced it up when I lived in London it came out to be about the same cost to live closer to the office than to commute even with public transport (which is not horrendously expensive) -- assuming I paid myself what my boss would pay me for my time commuting.

Re: Amazon Engineer Sues for Work from Home Costs

#17

Post by amykhar »

daenz wrote: post #7

The article makes 2 main points: 1) that this lawsuit will cause companies to take WFH away. and 2) It's extremely difficult to bill things like fractional electricity and internet usage. The first is a flimsy premise because companies simply don't have the power to take WFH away and I think they know that. If they did, they would. But the collectivization for WFH, brought by lockdowns, is far too powerful. So powerf…

My company solved it by giving everybody a flat rate every month. We can use it for internet or getting a better office chair, or whatever we see fit. Seems fair.

Re: Amazon Engineer Sues for Work from Home Costs

#18

Post by jen20 »

esoterica wrote: post #12
mmastrac wrote: post #5

It does raise the question of why large companies _aren't_ responsible for paying for commuting costs. We've obviously never done it that way, but is there a reason that we couldn't?

That means people with cheaper commutes get paid less than people with more expensive commutes. Why would you do that? You’re effectively rewarding people for living further from work and driving less fuel efficient vehicles, which both makes no business sense and is terrible for the environment.

> get paid less than people with more expensive commutes

Not if it is treated as expense reimbursement instead of salary.

Re: Amazon Engineer Sues for Work from Home Costs

#19

Post by wenc »

mmastrac wrote: post #5

It does raise the question of why large companies _aren't_ responsible for paying for commuting costs. We've obviously never done it that way, but is there a reason that we couldn't?

Actually many large companies subsidize or outright cover public transit costs. Many subsidize parking costs if they don’t provide free parking.

But mode of transportation is mostly left to the individual. They pay you enough and you can decide where to live and how to commute. Everybody’s needs are different — why have a program?

Re: Amazon Engineer Sues for Work from Home Costs

#20

Post by curiousgal »

daenz wrote: post #7

The article makes 2 main points: 1) that this lawsuit will cause companies to take WFH away. and 2) It's extremely difficult to bill things like fractional electricity and internet usage. The first is a flimsy premise because companies simply don't have the power to take WFH away and I think they know that. If they did, they would. But the collectivization for WFH, brought by lockdowns, is far too powerful. So powerf…

Such a myopic view. How would you onboard new employees? I started a new job remotely and it was hell. I learned more in the first two weeks in the office than I did in the first 2 months working remotely.
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