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Among Europe’s Ex-Royals

theatlantic.com

11–20 of 66 posts

Re: Among Europe’s Ex-Royals

#11
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You may want to remember the moment when the King of Spain successfully preserved the democracy of the country by shutting down a military coup just 40 years ago. "[...]the King of Spain appeared live on television, wearing the uniform of the Captain General of the Armed Forces (Capitán General de los Ejércitos), the highest Spanish military rank, to oppose the coup and its instigators, defend the Spanish Constitutio…

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Re: Among Europe’s Ex-Royals

#12
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I am from Brazil... The monarchs here been very useful: 1. Pedro I declared our independence, and later helped Portugal with some crap and became known there as Pedro the Liberator. 2. Pedro II believed in technology, half of all railways in Brazil was built during his reign, he installed the second telephone in the world in Brazil (the first was obviously, Graham Bell`s one), built a research centre in the same plac…

> The advantage of democracy, in theory, is that there is less violence to choose who is the next ruler... That said our current president was stabbed during elections, a former president was in prison for a while, and politicians here have a knack of having very weird deaths in inopportune moments...

I think you wanna say “the advantage of a republic” because a monarchy doesn’t mean lack of democracy. Many europeans countries are a monarchy and a democracy.

Monarchy and Republic are one thing. Democracy and Dictatorship is another thing.

Btw, great explanation about Dom Pedro II, many scholars call him “the magnanimous” and one of the best imperator of the modern times.

Re: Among Europe’s Ex-Royals

#13
post #7
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having a king didn’t help Italy too much. However Churchill probably had a point conservatives and monarchists weren’t really ever wholeheartedly committed to the survival of the Weimar republic. They might not had been as keen to undermine at every opportunity had it been ruled by a monarch. Then again , the nazis might just have turned the emperor into an impotent figurehead (as happened in Japan and Italy).

> Then again , the nazis might just have turned the emperor into an impotent figurehead (as happened in Japan and Italy). I bet that is exactly would have happened. The reality is that the advance of science and technology and general literacy was quickly eroding the traditional notion of the monarch having the consent of God or heaven. By the turn of the 20th century this was almost complete, and largely irreversibl…

There is an observation, though, that most European monarchies that turned into republics or dictatorships in the 20th century did so after losing a major war.

Monarchist countries like the Netherlands, Belgium, Denmark, Norway, Sweden, the UK ... that either stayed out of the war mess or ended up on the winning side were more likely to keep their monarchy.

Prior to the military conflagrations that started in 1914, vast majority of Europeans lived in monarchies, even though the democratization and personal emancipation process was well underway. The only republican countries in Europe at the outbreak of WWI were France, Switzerland and (very recently) Portugal. Well, and San Marino, yes.

Re: Among Europe’s Ex-Royals

#14
post #9
post #2

Quoted post unavailable.

You may want to remember the moment when the King of Spain successfully preserved the democracy of the country by shutting down a military coup just 40 years ago. "[...]the King of Spain appeared live on television, wearing the uniform of the Captain General of the Armed Forces (Capitán General de los Ejércitos), the highest Spanish military rank, to oppose the coup and its instigators, defend the Spanish Constitutio…

And before that ? When Franco was in power ? What did he do ?

Re: Among Europe’s Ex-Royals

#15
post #14
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You may want to remember the moment when the King of Spain successfully preserved the democracy of the country by shutting down a military coup just 40 years ago. "[...]the King of Spain appeared live on television, wearing the uniform of the Captain General of the Armed Forces (Capitán General de los Ejércitos), the highest Spanish military rank, to oppose the coup and its instigators, defend the Spanish Constitutio…

And before that ? When Franco was in power ? What did he do ?

The failed coup attempt was in 1981. Franco died in '75. Is history really this hard for some people?

Re: Among Europe’s Ex-Royals

#16
"what do the ex-royals have to offer Europe?" tldr: nothing, for the most part, with the exception of a long profile in the middle of the Albanian pretender, which discusses his argument that Albania is still so impoverished and shattered by the legacy of Communism that some sort of constitutional monarchy would help repair it and enable it to recover and reach its potential. That part is interesting.

Re: Among Europe’s Ex-Royals

#18
post #9
post #2

Quoted post unavailable.

You may want to remember the moment when the King of Spain successfully preserved the democracy of the country by shutting down a military coup just 40 years ago. "[...]the King of Spain appeared live on television, wearing the uniform of the Captain General of the Armed Forces (Capitán General de los Ejércitos), the highest Spanish military rank, to oppose the coup and its instigators, defend the Spanish Constitutio…

The same monarchy who supported the Franco fascist coup against the Republic, starting the civil war? Yes, very democratic.

Re: Among Europe’s Ex-Royals

#19
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Then again , the nazis might just have turned the emperor into an impotent figurehead (as happened in Japan and Italy). I bet that is exactly would have happened. The reality is that the advance of science and technology and general literacy was quickly eroding the traditional notion of the monarch having the consent of God or heaven. By the turn of the 20th century this was almost complete, and largely irreversibl…

There is an observation, though, that most European monarchies that turned into republics or dictatorships in the 20th century did so after losing a major war. Monarchist countries like the Netherlands, Belgium, Denmark, Norway, Sweden, the UK ... that either stayed out of the war mess or ended up on the winning side were more likely to keep their monarchy. Prior to the military conflagrations that started in 1914, v…

> Monarchist countries like the Netherlands, Belgium, Denmark, Norway, Sweden, the UK ... that either stayed out of the war mess or ended up on the winning side were more likely to keep their monarchy.

If I'm not mistaken, those are also countries that had already significantly diminished the actual power of their monarchs prior to WWI. The UK in particular arguably started that process centuries earlier with Magna Carta. On the other hand, places where the monarch retained the most power, like Russia, saw their monarchs assassinated pretty early in the industrial period.

Re: Among Europe’s Ex-Royals

#20
highly recommend Noble Blood podcast if you like this kind of stuff. totally changed my views on history. the narrator does a great job of showing that people are, and always have been, people - noble or not. part of the reason so many nobles died in the past is that people then didn't know what to do with ex-nobles either

https://noblebloodtales.com/

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