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Lithium drilling advances at the Salton Sea

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Re: Lithium drilling advances at the Salton Sea

#11

Post by elihu »

jelliclesfarm wrote: post #8
mullingitover wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How can they source potable fresh water for lithium extraction from brine without increasing salinity at Salton Sea? Also..we are in the midst of one of our scheduled droughts. There's a whole infographic in the article explaining this. > Hot brine is pumped up from deep underground, generating heat which is converted to electricity. Then, lithium is extracted from the brine before the fluid is injected back underg…

Right. What about salinity of the brine?

The brine is injected back underground, quite a bit cooler and minus some amount of lithium and chloride.

Re: Lithium drilling advances at the Salton Sea

#12

Post by kurthr »

CameronNemo wrote: post #9
mullingitover wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How can they source potable fresh water for lithium extraction from brine without increasing salinity at Salton Sea? Also..we are in the midst of one of our scheduled droughts. There's a whole infographic in the article explaining this. > Hot brine is pumped up from deep underground, generating heat which is converted to electricity. Then, lithium is extracted from the brine before the fluid is injected back underg…

The Colorado River doesn't have a lot of water by the time it gets to California, and the metropolises on the coast use a lot of it. If they really need freshwater for this, they will have to fight a lot of people for it.

I'm sorry I just broke out into laughter... you have to fight the FARMERS for it. The people in those cities (with their green lawns, golf courses, cemetaries, and fountains) just get what's left. Maybe they get 10-20% of the Colorado flows?

Re: Lithium drilling advances at the Salton Sea

#13

Post by wlesieutre »

jelliclesfarm wrote: post #8
mullingitover wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How can they source potable fresh water for lithium extraction from brine without increasing salinity at Salton Sea? Also..we are in the midst of one of our scheduled droughts. There's a whole infographic in the article explaining this. > Hot brine is pumped up from deep underground, generating heat which is converted to electricity. Then, lithium is extracted from the brine before the fluid is injected back underg…

Right. What about salinity of the brine?

They take out some of the lithium so the salinity of the brine is lowered a bit?

Re: Lithium drilling advances at the Salton Sea

#14

Post by bombcar »

idontwantthis wrote: post #10
TSiege wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The salton sea is a man made disaster. I couldn't see how it could be any worse than it is now. Given the dire climate situation we're in, it seems like a no brainer https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8TjGAWxL23c

If it dries out completely it will be much much worse.

We can always bring back Operation Plowshare and try to connect the Salton Sea to the Gulf of Mexico.

Re: Lithium drilling advances at the Salton Sea

#15

Post by kurthr »

idontwantthis wrote: post #10
TSiege wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The salton sea is a man made disaster. I couldn't see how it could be any worse than it is now. Given the dire climate situation we're in, it seems like a no brainer https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8TjGAWxL23c

If it dries out completely it will be much much worse.

Do you want to accidentally spill water from the Colorado into it again?

https://allthatsinteresting.com/salton-sea-history

Re: Lithium drilling advances at the Salton Sea

#16

Post by wsinks »

idontwantthis wrote: post #10
TSiege wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The salton sea is a man made disaster. I couldn't see how it could be any worse than it is now. Given the dire climate situation we're in, it seems like a no brainer https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8TjGAWxL23c

If it dries out completely it will be much much worse.

Just out of curiousity, how would it get much worse? I wonder if it wouldn't make it better since a lot of the water seems to just be so salty it kills everything.

Do you mean it'll just be drier and therefore suck more water out of the local ecosystem?

Re: Lithium drilling advances at the Salton Sea

#17

Post by mullingitover »

kurthr wrote: post #12
CameronNemo wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Colorado River doesn't have a lot of water by the time it gets to California, and the metropolises on the coast use a lot of it. If they really need freshwater for this, they will have to fight a lot of people for it.

I'm sorry I just broke out into laughter... you have to fight the FARMERS for it. The people in those cities (with their green lawns, golf courses, cemetaries, and fountains) just get what's left. Maybe they get 10-20% of the Colorado flows?

Plus, for all the noise farmers make, in California agriculture's contribution to the state GDP is fairly trivial, in the low single digits. At the scale this lithium mining operation could work, I imagine they would massively outbid the farmers for the water.

Indeed, if we gave up on farming in the area, we could cut an aqueduct from the Sea of Cortez and restore the Salton Sea to a thriving inland riviera. The real estate and tourism revenues would likely more than make up for the farming revenues.

Re: Lithium drilling advances at the Salton Sea

#18

Post by idontwantthis »

wsinks wrote: post #16
idontwantthis wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it dries out completely it will be much much worse.

Just out of curiousity, how would it get much worse? I wonder if it wouldn't make it better since a lot of the water seems to just be so salty it kills everything. Do you mean it'll just be drier and therefore suck more water out of the local ecosystem?

It is full of toxic materials from agricultural runoff. If it dries out then that will become a gigantic dust cloud that will poison millions of people.

Re: Lithium drilling advances at the Salton Sea

#19

Post by wmoser »

tonymet wrote: post #7

Interesting how similar that looks to an oil derrick

It probably is one. There’s nothing particularly special about the hole in the ground. It’s what you are trying to suck out. The oil industry has lots of knowledge about making holes, no point in reinventing the wheel.

Re: Lithium drilling advances at the Salton Sea

#20

Post by ggm »

The last 5 to 10 years has had a succession of doom-sayers riding the Paul Ehrlich line to "we will run out" -And as Julian Simons bet [0] showed, it may be true but it's based on a false premise of supply chain logistics, mining and planning.

In absolute terms yes, there is a finite amount of lithium in the crust. Transmutation aside, What we see in real life is unequal distribution and then bad modelling on assumptions this represents all available lithium when in reality it mistakes availability for existence. There is a lot more lithium in the world. The problem is finding it, and its price in extraction complexity, density, and other "costs"

The ramp up time to replace all ICE with EV will consume a lot of Lithium. I have no doubt there will be rises and falls in costs of Lithium extraction, as a function of the investment cycle and demand. What I do doubt, is that we will "run out" for any reason other than investment in this discovery and extraction. What they're doing in the Salton Sea is sensible, and what will happen in Australia (which also has lithium rich soils) is sensible, and no, we're not entirely captive to some fantasy of "there isn't enough lithium in the world"

Aside from anything else, there are other battery chemistries out there. Lithium battery chemistry is only the one we like now.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simon%E2%80%93Ehrlich_wager

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