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Psychedelics and mental illness

stuartritchie.substack.com

11–20 of 165 posts

Re: Psychedelics and mental illness

#11
The article makes a lot of good points. I'm a lover of psychedelics, I've apparently managed to be wired in a way that has made every single experience one that I don't regret (whether joyous, superficial, or intricate, unexpected), but I would never make the mistake of assuming my experience directly translates to other people's. Hype, cultists and people thinking in absolute only do a disservice to what we could extract from those experiences.

Serious research with people who are detached from the drugs is something we should all want, especially because we've only had a short time for detailed records of psychedelics experiences to exist at all and most experiences to this day aren't really observed scientifically at all. I believe that science is the best thing we've got to approach the unknown, psychedelics aren't a "godly exception".

I also remain aware that science doesn't always offer answers right away and we just keep on going anyway. It's been true for most technologies, for a lot of what goes in our food every day, for how we've structured society, etc. We accept that there's unknown risks, we try to mitigate what comes our way and prepare for what we can estimate, and we learn to live through what we didn't see. But we still eat the food, use the technologies, try social systems, and so on.

I think that attitude is also one to have with psychedelic experiences. That happens through testing what you have, guided experiences if and when there's a need or uncertainty, "set & setting" and discussing them beforehand, being gentle with dosage, making a sincere attempt at an inventory of the self before deciding on taking the psychs, and so on and so forth. And some people try some of it, some people don't, and that's OK as long as everyone strives to have an experience they can handle with what they know. Just like with everything else.

Re: Psychedelics and mental illness

#12
The article mentions Cover Story: Power Trip podcast which I finished last night and enjoyed so much. It’s by New York Magazine and the folks at Psymposia. Highly recommend as a balancing counterpoint to all the positive hype about psychedelics.

For the record, I have been both helped and harmed by psychedelics and in net believe their return is positive. I’ve seen enough oddities in the Bay Area psychedelics and mental health scenes to warrant some serious caution about the current path we’re taking.

Re: Psychedelics and mental illness

#13
post #4

I know a lot of cannabis fans (and count myself as one). Very, very few of them acknowledge that cannabis affects people inconsistently; one person's reaction to it can be very different than others. This is inconvenient for calling it a "medicine" so let's just ignore it. Psychedelics are even worse. The same dose of the same drug can produce wildly vary effects in the same person depending on factors we have troubl…

And we lack actual shamanic centers where we can do this stuff safely, where the dose is exact and you know what you're getting, and you can have guides to help you through the trip if things start feeling sketchy. And we could even have people on standby to administer anti-psychotic medicine in-case you have adverse reactions and need to calm down quickly before you do something stupid. The illegality of these subst…

I agree. And I also think that for the same reasons, the psychiatry system, at least the parts that I was exposed to, is abysmal. They prescribe according to whatever scriptbook is en vogue at the jurisdiction and the substances themselves are very far from proven - and also the part where you're guided on the trip you're having can be almost completely missing. There's a huge room for improvement in this area.

Re: Psychedelics and mental illness

#14
post #4

I know a lot of cannabis fans (and count myself as one). Very, very few of them acknowledge that cannabis affects people inconsistently; one person's reaction to it can be very different than others. This is inconvenient for calling it a "medicine" so let's just ignore it. Psychedelics are even worse. The same dose of the same drug can produce wildly vary effects in the same person depending on factors we have troubl…

And we lack actual shamanic centers where we can do this stuff safely, where the dose is exact and you know what you're getting, and you can have guides to help you through the trip if things start feeling sketchy. And we could even have people on standby to administer anti-psychotic medicine in-case you have adverse reactions and need to calm down quickly before you do something stupid. The illegality of these subst…

I think the issue starts with the moniker "shamanic", which does not sound like a place many people would trust their health to.

Re: Psychedelics and mental illness

#15
"This is just an anecdotal account, but there’s an interview with the psychedelics researcher Manoj Doss, who says that he “only know[s] one psychedelic researcher who’s never done psychedelics”, and notes (in an encouragingly self-critical way) that this is a conflict of interest." - Yeah that's a good point to be honest

I think that some of the most interesting applications for psychedelics as medicine target treatments that aren't strictly mental health related. Ketamine is already approved for ischemic brain damage or stroke, like you better hope that's the first thing you get in the ambulance to prevent glutamate excitotoxicity from getting really nasty if you fall of a motorcycle or whatever - But DMT actually shows a lot of promise for recovery too, and I'm actually getting involved in a project tangent to that research right now. We're talking sub-psychedelic micordoses to build people's neurons back from brain damage, one of those things in modern medicine we're still generally hopeless about. Pretty interesting stuff! [1]

[1] https://www.technologynetworks.com/neuroscience/blog/could-t...

Re: Psychedelics and mental illness

#16
I like the article. With psychedelics, it's clear that much of the excitement comes from people (including scientists) who have used them and found their experiences helpful. That's not science but that doesn't mean it's wrong. Not everything is amenable to clinical study and this doesn't mean we should disregard it.

And the issue isn't just psychedelics being hard to study. Mental health is hard to study. An overweight man with no friends who plays computer games all day is not depressed unless he feels bad about it. Mental health depends on subjective feelings. Hard to study that!

My view is that we should continue to think about psychedelics from a religious or spiritual perspective. Even if that's literally incorrect, it's the correct metaphor. I'm also very skeptical of people who think widespread use of psychedelics can make society better. Lots of people used LSD in the 60s and 70s and as far as I can tell they didn't usher in a new age of love, peace, and tolerance.

Re: Psychedelics and mental illness

#17

Do you think a disturbed work life balance could be a reason for mental illness as well?

Well… yes? Any stressor can be severe enough to cause problems in other areas of your life. It can also reveal undiagnosed mental illnesses.

Not sure how this relates to the article.

Re: Psychedelics and mental illness

#18

The author says > Quite a few psychedelic drugs are naturally-occurring, and have been used for hundreds of years (this doesn’t include synthetic ones like LSD, obviously). LSD occurs naturally in the Ergot mushroom: > The ergot fungus contains a number of highly poisonous and psychoactive alkaloids, including lysergic acid (LSD), which was synthesized from the ergot fungus in 1938 by chemist, Albert Hoffmann [1] Wha…

The US Forest Service is just wrong on this. Ergot does not contain LSD, although it contains very similar psychoactive alkaloids. Ergot cannot be called a mushroom, it is a fungus that grows on wheat, rye or other grains/grasses.

I think the confusion here is that LSD was initially synthesized from ergot fungus.

Ergot is not a mushroom and it does not contain LSD. But LSD is derived from the ergot alkaloids.

Re: Psychedelics and mental illness

#19
I liked the article and tend to agree there is a lot of pressure to rush psychedleics to the mainstream.

This is from a person who used MDMA to heal bipolar / schizophrenia in an underground setting; ran an underground clinic for 3 years; took funding from Dr. Bronner to found a non-profit to decriminalize plant medicine; and was featured in a PBS documentary administering MDMA in an underground setting.

Also, the author obviously hasn't done psychedelics ;) and he states as such.

"I’d think about taking them if I had a relevant condition and the evidence they worked was convincing." You could argue that the relevant condition is that you are a living human, and we've evolved to be in relationship to altered states of consciousness.

Re: Psychedelics and mental illness

#20
This argument seems disingenuous:

> Just as you’d feel extra-sceptical if all the research showing that pork is unhealthy was written by Muslims who’d already decided for religious reasons not to eat pork, you should be worried about the sheer number of studies by psychedelic researchers who are themselves aficionados of the drugs.

Perhaps a better analogy would be: just as you'd feel extra-skeptical if all the research showing that exercise is beneficial was written by exercisers who'd already decided for experiential reasons to exercise, ...

It's not like people are born into the religion of psychedelia and have strong cultural reasons to conform. If something truly is good, of course the people researching it are going to be "aficionados" of it. And this doesn't save it:

> (You might wonder if they’re into psychedelics precisely because the research shows such impressive benefits, switching around cause and effect. But as we’ll see below, that evidence doesn’t exist yet. That particular horse is coming way after the cart).

Why can't they be into it simply because it worked for them?

There's nothing about the fact that psychedelic researchers are excited about psychedelics that by itself is suspicious, as we are strongly being led to believe.

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