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Minimal Viable Product is old and busted

michaeldehaan.substack.com

11–20 of 132 posts

Re: Minimal Viable Product is old and busted

#11
> What is there to be careful of MVP as a strategy? Well, to start, I don’t think MVP works. The risk is you’re going to build something and nobody will come (or stay), and then you’ll run out of money.

MVPs don't exist in a vacuum, they are part of a larger effort to figure out your business model (what is the actual problem? Who are your customers? How will you make money?) in the most efficient way possible. For a MVP to make sense, you have to do user research and truly understand the problem domain.

> Your company shouldn’t be in search of a business model, you should know what you need to build.

This is wishful thinking. Tons of products and companies fail simply because founders think they "know" what their business model is when in fact it's just a bunch of unverified assumptions about the market.

Re: Minimal Viable Product is old and busted

#13
post #7

> An example of too much minimalism would be failing to implement UI pagination and your UI falling over with more than 20 objects, because you didn’t think about the use case. Maybe you haven’t thought about scale-out or upgrades or you can install on only one operating system. A serious buyer can sniff out this incompleteness and won’t take you seriously, and only serious domain experience can fill in these gaps. Y…

> IME this part is completely wrong, unless it's defining "serious buyer" in such a way that most of your market isn't one.

I used to be such a "serious buyer". I represented a large government agency with over 2,000 sites and several hundred thousand employees.

Vendors would turn up with "cute" web apps that used drop downs to select objects like security groups or user accounts. This works great when you're developing in a toy environment in your dev lab.

In the real world, merely clicking something like that will make both the server and client use gigabytes of memory until either one or both crash.

Here's the thing though: if you can put just a modicum of engineering effort into making your software suitable for non-toy scenarios, then winning even just one enterprise customer like this could make your rich. Win two or three similar orgs in other states or countries and you can start subscribing to Superyacht Owners' Quarterly.

But there will be no yacht because you used a drop-down. A simple control that can be implemented in minutes instead of a search box that takes a few extra lines of code.

Sorry...

PS: On a more serious note, I had a checklist that wasn't long or all that difficult to implement, and 90% of vendors would fail outright on most/all points.

    1. Search-for-select
    2. A provisioning API of some sort (REST, PowerShell, whatever)
    3. Hierarchical permissions & delegation
    4. Hierarchical policy & preferences
    5. Single-sign-on support
    6. Central audit & error logging
    7. Clone-to-deploy and/or highly automated setup.
    8. Don't demand Domain Admin rights for setup.
    9. No quadratic (or worse) scaling issues. (USE INDEXES in the DB!!)

Re: Minimal Viable Product is old and busted

#14
post #7

> An example of too much minimalism would be failing to implement UI pagination and your UI falling over with more than 20 objects, because you didn’t think about the use case. Maybe you haven’t thought about scale-out or upgrades or you can install on only one operating system. A serious buyer can sniff out this incompleteness and won’t take you seriously, and only serious domain experience can fill in these gaps. Y…

Exactly. Their advice essentially is – don't build an MVP, instead have a perfect working product with all features and a perfect market fit and huge demand with an years-long rigid roadmap on day one. Like...okay? And how do you do all this exactly?

Re: Minimal Viable Product is old and busted

#15
> The risk is you’re going to build something and nobody will come (or stay), and then you’ll run out of money.

Maybe author is conflating MVP with "build and they'll come". They're quite different ideas, although are frequently seen together in the same minds.

"Build and they'll come" is silly. 95% of businesses will need effort to bring products to consumers. Some form of marketing and/or sales.

One great risk is whether you can market and or sell the product. That's where MVPs help. Simulating marketing/sales without any product usually is not a good predictor of reality.

Re: Minimal Viable Product is old and busted

#16
Bit of an arrogant and directionless rant with no concrete detail and many false dichotomies. "Just build the right product" is like saying "just don't write bugs" or "just have money." It feels like DeHaan is reacting to the idea of exploration because he thinks you should just know everything to begin with.

Knowing everything upfront is definitely better than exploring your domain, product and market incrementally. The problem is that this rarely happens in practice. Founders who adopt DeHaan's attitude and think they can leapfrog the exploratory phase of their startup usually end up failing.

Re: Minimal Viable Product is old and busted

#17
post #7

> An example of too much minimalism would be failing to implement UI pagination and your UI falling over with more than 20 objects, because you didn’t think about the use case. Maybe you haven’t thought about scale-out or upgrades or you can install on only one operating system. A serious buyer can sniff out this incompleteness and won’t take you seriously, and only serious domain experience can fill in these gaps. Y…

> IME this part is completely wrong, unless it's defining "serious buyer" in such a way that most of your market isn't one. I used to be such a "serious buyer". I represented a large government agency with over 2,000 sites and several hundred thousand employees. Vendors would turn up with "cute" web apps that used drop downs to select objects like security groups or user accounts. This works great when you're develop…

> merely clicking something like that will make both the server and client use gigabytes of memory until either one or both crash

Curious as to how clicking on an UI object would consume gigabytes of memory, both in frontend and backend?

Re: Minimal Viable Product is old and busted

#18
post #15

> The risk is you’re going to build something and nobody will come (or stay), and then you’ll run out of money. Maybe author is conflating MVP with "build and they'll come". They're quite different ideas, although are frequently seen together in the same minds. "Build and they'll come" is silly. 95% of businesses will need effort to bring products to consumers. Some form of marketing and/or sales. One great risk is w…

> Maybe author is conflating MVP with "build and they'll come". They're quite different ideas, although are frequently seen together in the same minds.

I think the author is pointing out that other people are conflating the ideas. I don't think the author advocates building a fully-fledged 1.0 product before getting real-world feedback.

I've worked for startups that kept shouting "MVP, MVP" for each new feature (and customer) we built. What we got in return for that was a heap of half-finished features, lots of technical debt — and not a single happy customer.

Re: Minimal Viable Product is old and busted

#20
post #15

> The risk is you’re going to build something and nobody will come (or stay), and then you’ll run out of money. Maybe author is conflating MVP with "build and they'll come". They're quite different ideas, although are frequently seen together in the same minds. "Build and they'll come" is silly. 95% of businesses will need effort to bring products to consumers. Some form of marketing and/or sales. One great risk is w…

"Build it and they'll come" is pure survivor's bias. It's true that there are some products (Wordle, Minecraft, Undertale, lots of other indie games, ...) that were built by single developers or small teams with little to no marketing and became wildly successful anyway. But nobody is remembering the thousands of products that tried to follow this strategy and failed (or still exist in complete obscurity).
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