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There is no such thing as a CEO of pre-product startup. Get off of it.

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Re: There is no such thing as a CEO of pre-product startup. Get off of it.

#11

Post by mikeryan »

When I launched my (non-startup - services) business I called myself CEO. This had some nice side effects,for some reason people (reporters, researchers) would call me for advice. But it seemed lame to call myself the CEO of one-person company. We are now more then one but I've taken titles off our business cards, instead just letting our clients know our roles ie "Technical, Design etc".

While we are still small, less then 10 folks, we're going to keep it that way since we all wear many different hats at this point. We'll get titles eventually - but we'll also get more structure as we grow so we'll wait until we need it.

Re: There is no such thing as a CEO of pre-product startup. Get off of it.

#12

Post by randomdata »

Duff wrote: post #9

I think it's appropriate to have a title on a business card or whatever that describes your role in a meaningful way. "Principal", "Founder", etc. Corporate titles sound silly in small businesses -- I had my driveway sealed by the "President and CEO" of a driveway sealing business the other day. People in contact with customers should have flexibility or use multiple titles. If you're trying to get an audience with a…

I never understood the point of having a title. I find the government is especially interested in my title/occupation and I never know what I should be telling them.

Professionally, I am a farmer, a programmer, a designer, an administrator, and was even a baker for a short while; though, sadly, I gave it up as it was too time consuming on top of the rest. Not to mention all of the business stuff that goes along with doing those jobs, like management, sales, mechanic in the case of my farm, etc, etc.

Why are people so hung up on them? They are pretty meaningless.

Re: There is no such thing as a CEO of pre-product startup. Get off of it.

#13

Post by prodigal_erik »

> And if your early guys ask what they should put on their resume, tell them put anything down.

If you are called about a former employee and can't answer the question "what was their title" with something more concrete than "meh, whatever", you will sound like a fraudulent reference. You're inadvertently screwing over your employees if you don't pick something reasonable and stick with it (modulo actual role changes or promotions due to growth).

Re: There is no such thing as a CEO of pre-product startup. Get off of it.

#14

Post by alttag »

jeffreymcmanus wrote: post #6

This looks like it's a problem with job titles but it's really a problem with managing people. The job title is just the symptom. I have a talk with everyone who works for me in which I say "this is a startup, job titles are flexible, and everybody (including me) will have to revisit their role and title frequently. If you're OK with that, then great. If not, we should talk it through now so everybody's expectations…

Wait .. you're saying that good leadership is setting expectations early, being consistent, and following up on them?!

Of course it is. In my experience those are the two hardest things for people (including me) to do.

Re: There is no such thing as a CEO of pre-product startup. Get off of it.

#15

Post by MediaSquirrel »

powertower wrote: post #7

Another three letter word - EGO - combined with delusion will get you all kinds of fancy titles. My rule of thumb is that a business of less than 7 people should have 1 "Manager" (not CEO, President, etc), and everyone else should be an employee (plus additional reasonable titles such as co-founder, etc). As the business grows and more people are brought onboard you can start handing out titles. This might not work i…

In military lingo, it's called Span of Control. 3 reports is the minimum, 5 the ideal, 7 the max.

Re: There is no such thing as a CEO of pre-product startup. Get off of it.

#16

Post by alttag »

This is partly the reason I didn't take the CTO title when I joined a startup years ago. They gave me the flexibility to essentially pick my own title; I eventually settled on "Director, Software Development".

In addition to avoiding the friction, I had hired (and rejected) several "CEOs" for entry-level student tech-support jobs several years previous, and wanted to avoid the presumptions that went along with the title. I was young, and wanted to be taken seriously when I introduced myself. "CTO" of a company no one had heard of didn't communicate that.

Re: There is no such thing as a CEO of pre-product startup. Get off of it.

#17

Post by MediaSquirrel »

It sounds to me like you're misdiagnosing the problem. The problem isn't too much hierarchy, it's too little! Your CEO friend needs to grow a pair and demote his CTO co-founder. Ideally, he would sell his co-founder on the idea of doing this voluntarily. This will not be an easy discussion.

Titles and hierarchy matter in a startup because someone has to be able to make decisions in the face of disagreement. Decision making by committee leads to a lot of really mediocre decisions--like keeping a co-founder as CTO despite being unqualified for the job!

This decision-by-committee dynamic happened early on in my current startup. Mostly, the problem was engineers having an equal say in marketing and financing decisions––a topic they were not focused on or very familiar with, yet had strong opinions about. This was dumb. It took one of the founders of Netflix giving me/us a swift kick in the ass to get over it. No longer. We now divide and conquer. The company is much better for it.

Every company needs a CEO. And if the CEO is not technical, then the company is eventually going to need a CTO as well. But that's about it in terms of C-level officers. A small company should not have 4 chiefs. What that really means is the company has NO chief.

Being a C-level person means being responsible for long term big picture shit and management and leadership, not just coding. For myself, I am extremely fortunate to have a visionary co-founder and CTO with real leadership qualities. He is a partner in the true sense of the word. I expect him to stay CTO for a long, long time––unless I decide to demote myself and make him the CEO. (Might happen, who knows?) Regardless, the buck has to stop somewhere. And that somewhere is the CEO. There can only be one.

Re: There is no such thing as a CEO of pre-product startup. Get off of it.

#18

Post by eavc »

randomdata wrote: post #12
Duff wrote: post #9

I think it's appropriate to have a title on a business card or whatever that describes your role in a meaningful way. "Principal", "Founder", etc. Corporate titles sound silly in small businesses -- I had my driveway sealed by the "President and CEO" of a driveway sealing business the other day. People in contact with customers should have flexibility or use multiple titles. If you're trying to get an audience with a…

I never understood the point of having a title. I find the government is especially interested in my title/occupation and I never know what I should be telling them. Professionally, I am a farmer, a programmer, a designer, an administrator, and was even a baker for a short while; though, sadly, I gave it up as it was too time consuming on top of the rest. Not to mention all of the business stuff that goes along with…

Because labels are useful for quickly making sense of random data. (Pun intended but incidental.)
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