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Attacking an Ethereum L2 with Unbridled Optimism

saurik.com

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Re: Attacking an Ethereum L2 with Unbridled Optimism

#11

Post by vmception »

sschueller wrote: post #9
iskander wrote: post #5

This is a concerning aspect of Ethereum's strategy to push scaling to layer-2 networks: Ethereum is a heavily audited and tested protocol that runs an extremely decentralized network of diverse clients. L2s can be...an AWS instance running arbitrary buggy code. Much of the confidence in the "base layer" that people using Ethereum currently experience will be significantly undermined if mundane transactions wend in an…

Isn't the whole lightning network for bitcoin also L2?

hm okay, room for nuance, there are at about a dozen L2 technologies in deployment right now, each with multiple competitors using a specific technology.

Re: Attacking an Ethereum L2 with Unbridled Optimism

#12

Post by rawtxapp »

sschueller wrote: post #9
iskander wrote: post #5

This is a concerning aspect of Ethereum's strategy to push scaling to layer-2 networks: Ethereum is a heavily audited and tested protocol that runs an extremely decentralized network of diverse clients. L2s can be...an AWS instance running arbitrary buggy code. Much of the confidence in the "base layer" that people using Ethereum currently experience will be significantly undermined if mundane transactions wend in an…

Isn't the whole lightning network for bitcoin also L2?

It's L2, but you can have different types of L2s. With lightning network, you're opening and closing channels with a counterparty using on-chain transactions, so each channel can be tied back to an on-chain transaction.

Before someone points out that it would require tons of on-chain transactions to onboard everyone onto it, you can batch thousands of channel open/closes into a single transaction with new protocol upgrades.

Re: Attacking an Ethereum L2 with Unbridled Optimism

#13

Post by soco »

iskander wrote: post #5

This is a concerning aspect of Ethereum's strategy to push scaling to layer-2 networks: Ethereum is a heavily audited and tested protocol that runs an extremely decentralized network of diverse clients. L2s can be...an AWS instance running arbitrary buggy code. Much of the confidence in the "base layer" that people using Ethereum currently experience will be significantly undermined if mundane transactions wend in an…

Correct me if I'm wrong, but with those L2 tricks the plusvalue of Ethereum gets kinda diluted... and there's already a heavy discussion on the "why should I use it at all".

Re: Attacking an Ethereum L2 with Unbridled Optimism

#14

Post by serverholic »

iskander wrote: post #5

This is a concerning aspect of Ethereum's strategy to push scaling to layer-2 networks: Ethereum is a heavily audited and tested protocol that runs an extremely decentralized network of diverse clients. L2s can be...an AWS instance running arbitrary buggy code. Much of the confidence in the "base layer" that people using Ethereum currently experience will be significantly undermined if mundane transactions wend in an…

Ethereum didn't start that way, it had to build trust over time just like any other project. Eventually L2s will get there too.

Re: Attacking an Ethereum L2 with Unbridled Optimism

#15

Post by vmception »

saurik wrote: post #8
vmception wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow. A tutorial on doing that would be great. Speaking of "bug bounties", I use the term liberally as a euphemism for hacking these contracts and taking everything for yourself under the observation that company/community bug bounty systems are broken and undervalued for the value they provide. Although seen as a euphamism now, I think the term is accurate especially when looking at how bounty was used in the America…

> ...because many people still don't understand that this is analogous and convertible to money in your bank account especially at these convenient amounts... FWIW this project doesn't have its own token (this L2 uses ETH as its currency just like the base layer), so the bug bounty payout is denominated in actual USD.

Whether they paid in ETH priced in USD, or a stablecoin, or a USD wire to your bank account, many people aren't aware that getting paid in this space is that lucrative and that liquid and that simple.

Re: Attacking an Ethereum L2 with Unbridled Optimism

#16

Post by serverholic »

soco wrote: post #13
iskander wrote: post #5

This is a concerning aspect of Ethereum's strategy to push scaling to layer-2 networks: Ethereum is a heavily audited and tested protocol that runs an extremely decentralized network of diverse clients. L2s can be...an AWS instance running arbitrary buggy code. Much of the confidence in the "base layer" that people using Ethereum currently experience will be significantly undermined if mundane transactions wend in an…

Correct me if I'm wrong, but with those L2 tricks the plusvalue of Ethereum gets kinda diluted... and there's already a heavy discussion on the "why should I use it at all".

You're going to have to explain. L2 heavily rely on the Ethereum base layer.

Re: Attacking an Ethereum L2 with Unbridled Optimism

#17

Post by SilasX »

iskander wrote: post #5

This is a concerning aspect of Ethereum's strategy to push scaling to layer-2 networks: Ethereum is a heavily audited and tested protocol that runs an extremely decentralized network of diverse clients. L2s can be...an AWS instance running arbitrary buggy code. Much of the confidence in the "base layer" that people using Ethereum currently experience will be significantly undermined if mundane transactions wend in an…

Yes! I got burned by Optimism in another way. They tell you to point your applications at etherscan.io for transaction data/history, but then, on November 11 last year, the pushed an update that deletes all transaction history up to that point, which you need for taxes!

They swore they'd have the history restored on Etherscan by Nov 18th, but they still haven't. Only recently they pushed a workaround that lets you download the transactions as a CSV, but that lacks the critical data from your transfers of non-ETH tokens. And then, an alternative source does have that data, but only as a binary blob you have to run through a decoder and parse out yourself.

The crypto tax software, of course, doesn't know what to do with it.

(Even if your local client cached the transactions, most, like MetaMask, left out the critical data above.)

68 days till the filing deadline in the US!

I asked the maintainers how they planned to do their own taxes, and one of them claimed that he was separately recording all sales in a spreadsheet. I had to inform them that the taxable events include more than just sales, and, even under the most aggressive interpretation of tax law, you need the other data to figure cost basis.

Re: Attacking an Ethereum L2 with Unbridled Optimism

#19

Post by SubiculumCode »

serverholic wrote: post #14
iskander wrote: post #5

This is a concerning aspect of Ethereum's strategy to push scaling to layer-2 networks: Ethereum is a heavily audited and tested protocol that runs an extremely decentralized network of diverse clients. L2s can be...an AWS instance running arbitrary buggy code. Much of the confidence in the "base layer" that people using Ethereum currently experience will be significantly undermined if mundane transactions wend in an…

Ethereum didn't start that way, it had to build trust over time just like any other project. Eventually L2s will get there too.

Same with Polygon their Ethereum L2+Sidechaining scaling solutions. Polygon is quickly building a reputation for solid secure code, mostly because their team kicks ass and is proactive.

Re: Attacking an Ethereum L2 with Unbridled Optimism

#20

Post by seibelj »

vmception wrote: post #15
saurik wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> ...because many people still don't understand that this is analogous and convertible to money in your bank account especially at these convenient amounts... FWIW this project doesn't have its own token (this L2 uses ETH as its currency just like the base layer), so the bug bounty payout is denominated in actual USD.

Whether they paid in ETH priced in USD, or a stablecoin, or a USD wire to your bank account, many people aren't aware that getting paid in this space is that lucrative and that liquid and that simple.

saurik is pretty famous, I would estimate that most serious players in this space know the money is here. What is good about this post and the fact it's on top of HN is that maybe the average HN reader will be curious and help shift the crypto narrative on HN from negativity to at least neutrality.
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