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Tell HN: A Conversation Needs to Be Had over Subscription Software

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Re: Tell HN: A Conversation Needs to Be Had over Subscription Software

#11
post #2

Seems to me that there is an inherent contradiction at the heart of SAAS. A service either: - Has a big enough moat that its immune to competition - in which case you get rent seeking behaviour; or - It's vulnerable and could disappear / become economically unviable so you wouldn't want to have your business rely on it. So you essentially have to choose between two unpalatable choices.

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Re: Tell HN: A Conversation Needs to Be Had over Subscription Software

#13
Couldn't agree more. I was working in a company that didn't allow local checkouts. You'd have to work in a remote VM. Next step was going to fully remote desktops (i.e. dumb terminals). For security reasons (whatever). I hated every moment of it as it made feedback times longer and for doing anything at all you needed to beg the IT people. But the weirdest part is that other devs didn't seem to mind. (Not to mention all the spyware crap installed on our machines and the whole mentality of security over productivity. All of it -security- sold to us by third parties as a service (nvm how absurd it is to trust N other companies to keep you secure). Anyhow this place was surreal but I'm afraid it's not the only one).

So to answer the question of how we came here: The same way anything in the commons sphere rots and dies. Not enough people care enough about it. They're OK giving away control one way or another and companies are more than happy to sell it as a service. What user gets in return is diminishing but once the process starts it's kind of runaway I'm afraid.

Re: Tell HN: A Conversation Needs to Be Had over Subscription Software

#14
As a consumer, do you need to participate in these transactions?

I bought MS Office (non-subscription) and honestly Google Docs/Sheets (free tier) works for most of my needs.

While Apple wants to push subscription apps, you don't need to subscribe to them. I don't. If the value is there, sure subscribe to them.

Apple is pretty in your face with selling their services. I get nagware iCloud storage limit subscription notifications that I can't dismiss. They are pushing for Arcade, TV+, Music, etc. sign -ups in their OS settings. I haven't paid for them and don't intend to.

Just because these paid subscriptions exist does not mean they are entitled to your money every month.

Re: Tell HN: A Conversation Needs to Be Had over Subscription Software

#15
It just means that you don't own the software that you run. Always having to have an account and sign in and pay the subscription tax otherwise you lose access to it.

Now with games becoming digital, if you break their 'terms of service' they can lock and ban your account; taking your 'digital' games away or even locking the console. (Unless you paid for the physical version.)

Re: Tell HN: A Conversation Needs to Be Had over Subscription Software

#16
I’m running a super simple translation management system where people can manage, host, auto-translate their translation files. How I supposed to run my app without subscriptions?

In last 30 days, I transferred over 280 GB of translation data from my service to end-users around the word. Should I tell DeepL, Google and AWS that they should offer me their services for free or what?

EDIT:

I apologize if this sounds too passive-aggressive, but I'm tired of hearing that subscriptions are bad. Thanks to subscription model, we can have many smaller service providers who simply have fun from working on something (like me). If you think that giving someone $5/mo for a cool app is too much, then okay. You don't have to do it, no deal. ¯\_(ツ)\_/¯

PS Great example of solo-developer is the InkDrop creator. He is working on this note-taking app since ~2016. https://www.inkdrop.app

Re: Tell HN: A Conversation Needs to Be Had over Subscription Software

#18
This sort of began when we all got the impression that software should be free, or that we pay a low price once and get indefinite free upgrades. Given that developers need to be paid, and resources cost money, there needs to be a way to rectify that gap between the consumer and maintainer. At one point we did so by paying for an initial version of software, and then paying for updates. Now that we don’t do that, but someone still needs a revenue stream to pay for the costs of maintaining and evolving software, the subscription model has emerged. It’s really not that complicated. Where it gets hostile is when you see a subscription model for something where the subscription doesn’t yield any evidence of effort from the provider. For example, a subscription to software that never sees updates nor has infrastructure costs. That’s just a money grab.

What confuses me is seeing this kind of question on the same forum where people often gripe about not being paid the 6 digit salary they expect to produce the software we use. How do you achieve super cheap products made by people making super high pay? Money doesn’t just materialize out of thin air to make that work.

PS: my comment comes off as advocating for the subscription model. I personally hate it with a passion: I’d rather pay for upgrades/updates to code, and pay for resources metered by my usage. My comment should be interpreted as understanding where the model comes from, not necessarily liking it.

Re: Tell HN: A Conversation Needs to Be Had over Subscription Software

#19
post #3
post #2

Seems to me that there is an inherent contradiction at the heart of SAAS. A service either: - Has a big enough moat that its immune to competition - in which case you get rent seeking behaviour; or - It's vulnerable and could disappear / become economically unviable so you wouldn't want to have your business rely on it. So you essentially have to choose between two unpalatable choices.

I think a large part of the problem is that so much software (like Office) is turning into a service when it doesn’t need to be.

I think a large part of the problem is that so much software (like Office) is turning into a service when it doesn’t need to be.

One significant advantage of SaaS over traditional download-and-run-and-pay-for-updates apps is the fact that everyone is always on the same version. In a large organisation, and across organisational boundaries, working around people using different versions of things is an incredibly inefficient use of time.

Office 365 is worth the money for that reason alone.

Re: Tell HN: A Conversation Needs to Be Had over Subscription Software

#20
Interestingly enough, my business makes more money with offering one time payments. I set the one time price to how much the subscription would cost over 2 years. Because my SMB customers were churning after just a couple of months, this switch 6x-ed my revenue per customer, but reduced my number of new customers by around 3 times. So in total 2x more revenue with 3x less work :) [Setting up new customers took manual work, so not 100% SaaS]
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