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US Fed – Employee Religious Exception Request Information System

federalregister.gov

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Re: US Fed – Employee Religious Exception Request Information System

#11

Post by thinkingemote »

KennyBlanken wrote: post #5

Religious exemptions from vaccination are bullshit. 1)Objections based on "fetal cell lines" being used in development apply to such a large swath of drugs that anyone who held that view "legitimately" would be unable to accept almost any form of modern medical care - including "when you get home, take a tylenol for the pain." 2)No major religion supports vaccination exemptions. Most religious leaders have expressly…

There's more of a moral maze when it comes to forced, mandated vaccination, which I think this is about.

For example, it can be argued that it is an individuals right to choose what happens to their body, healthcare should be voluntary and people should expect no penalty in a healthy free society.

That's different than if a vaccine is morally ok to choose voluntarily.

Re: US Fed – Employee Religious Exception Request Information System

#12

Post by imperio59 »

arcticbull wrote: post #4
whb07 wrote: post #2

Let's maintain a list full of what we perceive are our ideological enemies. Great!

Quoted post unavailable.

Organized religion does not need to forbid anything. Religion is about personal belief. The supreme court has already ruled what matters is what the individual believes not what the organized religious institution says.

Re: US Fed – Employee Religious Exception Request Information System

#13

Post by hash872 »

If I were designing a constitutional system for a new country, I'd certainly include freedom of religion as one of the basic rights- while also codifying that there are no religious exemptions to any laws. Regardless of your faith, you are required to follow the same laws as your fellow citizens, without exception. Religious exemptions should not exist.

One of my issues with it is that 'religion' can mean whatever you want it to mean. There are absolutely zero, to my knowledge, religions whose founders or holy texts preached against vaccination. When did Christ or Mohamed say vaccinations were outlawed, exactly? And millions of believers take vaccines- but then some of them also claim that it's 'against their religion'. How is it against your religion, when none of the founders stated this, and the majority of people in your own religion are using vaccines without issue? Why not say that paying taxes or stop signs are against your religion next?

Exemptions allow bad faith claims that one's personal preferences are their 'religion'. They should be constitutionally outlawed

Re: US Fed – Employee Religious Exception Request Information System

#14

Post by jacobmartin »

KennyBlanken wrote: post #5

Religious exemptions from vaccination are bullshit. 1)Objections based on "fetal cell lines" being used in development apply to such a large swath of drugs that anyone who held that view "legitimately" would be unable to accept almost any form of modern medical care - including "when you get home, take a tylenol for the pain." 2)No major religion supports vaccination exemptions. Most religious leaders have expressly…

1) assumes that all levels of 'cooperation' with what you perceive to be evil are equivalent. I happen to agree that both testing medication and using cell lines to develop it are more or less equally distal to the original problem (as it is perceived), but not all people do. (The distinctions between formal and material cooperation, and proximal and distal cooperation, are relevant to many ethical systems, even outside of religion.)

2) is irrelevant to people not in the camps of 'most religious leaders' or a 'major religion.'

I mostly agree with you on 3). I think some positions are simply not open to some people with certain religious beliefs. A devout Muslim cannot work at a liquor store. An evangelical cannot be the JP anymore. An anti-COVID vaxxer (even for religious reasons) can't work for the federal government. So it goes.

However, these considerations are only tangentially relevant to a consideration of the morality of a register on these exemptions.

Re: US Fed – Employee Religious Exception Request Information System

#16

Post by arcticbull »

imperio59 wrote: post #12
arcticbull wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

Organized religion does not need to forbid anything. Religion is about personal belief. The supreme court has already ruled what matters is what the individual believes not what the organized religious institution says.

On the other hand, your religious freedoms end where my rights and freedoms begin. I cannot practice religious beliefs that allow me to harm myself or others and it is not crazy to believe that extends to practices which spread pestilence.

I think this strikes the right balance, creating barriers for anti-vaxxers to jump through while still not forbidding free exercise of legitimate religious beliefs.

Re: US Fed – Employee Religious Exception Request Information System

#17

Post by beecafe »

imperio59 wrote: post #10
azinman2 wrote: post #3

I wonder if even a majority of people who file one have a legitimate religious objection instead of abusing this ability to get out of mandates.

I wonder if the governments enforcing mandates have a legitimate reason to enforce them. There FTFY.

Government actions are legitimate by definition, being them who defines what is legit.

Re: US Fed – Employee Religious Exception Request Information System

#18

Post by [deleted] »

imperio59 wrote: post #12
arcticbull wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

Organized religion does not need to forbid anything. Religion is about personal belief. The supreme court has already ruled what matters is what the individual believes not what the organized religious institution says.

[deleted]

Re: US Fed – Employee Religious Exception Request Information System

#19

Post by imperio59 »

arcticbull wrote: post #8
antihipocrat wrote: post #6

If anyone can offer a reason as to why this system is beneficial to public health, safety or security, I'd love to hear it. I can only see a detriment to each if this law was put into effect.

Easy. It will dissuade people who don't hold legitimate religious beliefs forbidding vaccination (there are substantially zero of them) from using religious exemptions. This will increase the vaccination percentages, reducing spread and keeping ICUs available for folks who didn't elect their condition. [edit] I'm sorry, if you choose to prioritize conspiracy theories over your health and that of others, I'm not at al…

We've only had mRNA vaccines for two years.

Also there are starting to be plenty of companies requiring boosters. Do you want to get a new experimental vaccine whose long term effects are poorly known every few months?

Re: US Fed – Employee Religious Exception Request Information System

#20

Post by listless »

azinman2 wrote: post #3

I wonder if even a majority of people who file one have a legitimate religious objection instead of abusing this ability to get out of mandates.

I think most of it is abuse. Of course, I can’t measure it so we don’t know. But anecdotally I can say that my wife uses it. She is very religious and while our religion doesn’t specifically forbid vaccines (how could it - the texts are quite old) she doesn’t want the vaccine so she finds scriptures to back up her position. They are vague passages that _could_ be seen as being specific to vaccines, but of course that’s impossible because they didn’t exist.

All said to say, you can use scripture to justify anything you want or don’t want. Just examine…all of history?

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