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Sen. Joe Manchin says no to $2T bill: ‘I can’t vote for it’

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Re: Sen. Joe Manchin says no to $2T bill: ‘I can’t vote for it’

#11

Post by marricks »

It’s funny because he argued for a year saying he would if he got A, gets it, then says he needs B… on and on until like L then when its finally in front of him to vote he acts like he never could anyways. People like this are the skeeziest.

Then again, there seems to always need to be 1 democrat who will stand in the way of getting things done everyday people want. It was Joe Lieberman when democrats last had the senate. Who knows what the senate leaders would actually allow to happen but it’s easier to have all that hate on one Joe.

Re: Sen. Joe Manchin says no to $2T bill: ‘I can’t vote for it’

#12

Post by thghtihadanacct »

rafale wrote: post #6
syki wrote: post #3

Democratic senators represent 40 million more people than Republican senators and their agenda can't be passed. The last time Republican senators represented more than half the population was 1996. Rural, low population states have far too much power in the present system. This is not sustainable. I know Manchin is nominally a Democrat but it's not him that is blocking the legislation it is him and all 50 Republican…

The US is a republic, not a democracy. And for good reasons. Otherwise, politicians will try to one-up each other with promises of freebies. It's easy to win elections when you promise free healthcare, free education, free childcare,... The average person will vote in their immediate interest and not worry about the big picture. The big picture: nothing is free.

I dont remember seeing the word 'free' in the posted article anywhere related to the paying for this bill. In fact, it clearly states the cost will come from taxes on the wealthy ... whom Manchin represents.

Re: Sen. Joe Manchin says no to $2T bill: ‘I can’t vote for it’

#13

Post by xqcgrek2 »

Joe Manchin is taking the hit for a lot of other Democrats would would vote against this insane irresponsible bill, but can't let their intensions be publicly known.

It was a foregone conclusion this bill would fail in this way once it was split up from the real infrastructure bill.

Re: Sen. Joe Manchin says no to $2T bill: ‘I can’t vote for it’

#14

Post by solarhoma »

DennisAleynikov wrote: post #4
syki wrote: post #3

Democratic senators represent 40 million more people than Republican senators and their agenda can't be passed. The last time Republican senators represented more than half the population was 1996. Rural, low population states have far too much power in the present system. This is not sustainable. I know Manchin is nominally a Democrat but it's not him that is blocking the legislation it is him and all 50 Republican…

population density isn't how our legislature is set up. not sure why people always bring this incredibly irrelevant statistic up.

There is a push to water down rural votes (typically conservative) as democrats feel they are not represented fairly among the senate. Arguing that Wyoming should not have the same power in the senate that California has with many more people. The US government was not set up as a pure democracy but rather a republic. They forget the founding fathers did this to prevent a tyranny by majority. The ones arguing for abolishing this process are ok with tyranny by majority rule only because they find themselves in the majority. But too quickly forget that one day they will likely find themselves in the minority. Wishing they had these protections back.

Re: Sen. Joe Manchin says no to $2T bill: ‘I can’t vote for it’

#16

Post by synergy20 »

rafale wrote: post #6
syki wrote: post #3

Democratic senators represent 40 million more people than Republican senators and their agenda can't be passed. The last time Republican senators represented more than half the population was 1996. Rural, low population states have far too much power in the present system. This is not sustainable. I know Manchin is nominally a Democrat but it's not him that is blocking the legislation it is him and all 50 Republican…

The US is a republic, not a democracy. And for good reasons. Otherwise, politicians will try to one-up each other with promises of freebies. It's easy to win elections when you promise free healthcare, free education, free childcare,... The average person will vote in their immediate interest and not worry about the big picture. The big picture: nothing is free.

Exactly right. "Rural, low population states have far too much power in the present system. This is not sustainable" is wrong in that, pure democracy leads to pure majority rule, which causes stability issues in no time, history tells a lot of those stories.

Re: Sen. Joe Manchin says no to $2T bill: ‘I can’t vote for it’

#17

Post by errcorrectcode »

syki wrote: post #3

Democratic senators represent 40 million more people than Republican senators and their agenda can't be passed. The last time Republican senators represented more than half the population was 1996. Rural, low population states have far too much power in the present system. This is not sustainable. I know Manchin is nominally a Democrat but it's not him that is blocking the legislation it is him and all 50 Republican…

Gerrymandering is completely out of control. Mostly R's are locking-in their wins for the foreseeable future.

I don't think it's a D/R thing in particular. He's completely corrupt by WV coal and other corporate interests paying him to be an insurgent DINO to do their bidding. Sinema is clearly a nutter and possibly corrupt too. The D's and R's also contain too many corrupt, plutocrat sycophants to name individually here. The system is what's broken, and it's doubtful it can be fixed from within.

Re: Sen. Joe Manchin says no to $2T bill: ‘I can’t vote for it’

#18

Post by Ekaros »

rafale wrote: post #6
syki wrote: post #3

Democratic senators represent 40 million more people than Republican senators and their agenda can't be passed. The last time Republican senators represented more than half the population was 1996. Rural, low population states have far too much power in the present system. This is not sustainable. I know Manchin is nominally a Democrat but it's not him that is blocking the legislation it is him and all 50 Republican…

The US is a republic, not a democracy. And for good reasons. Otherwise, politicians will try to one-up each other with promises of freebies. It's easy to win elections when you promise free healthcare, free education, free childcare,... The average person will vote in their immediate interest and not worry about the big picture. The big picture: nothing is free.

It is democracy, but it also federal republic. Important qualifier is the federal. There are also lot of non-federal republics.

Re: Sen. Joe Manchin says no to $2T bill: ‘I can’t vote for it’

#19

Post by kergonath »

rafale wrote: post #6
syki wrote: post #3

Democratic senators represent 40 million more people than Republican senators and their agenda can't be passed. The last time Republican senators represented more than half the population was 1996. Rural, low population states have far too much power in the present system. This is not sustainable. I know Manchin is nominally a Democrat but it's not him that is blocking the legislation it is him and all 50 Republican…

The US is a republic, not a democracy. And for good reasons. Otherwise, politicians will try to one-up each other with promises of freebies. It's easy to win elections when you promise free healthcare, free education, free childcare,... The average person will vote in their immediate interest and not worry about the big picture. The big picture: nothing is free.

> The US is a republic, not a democracy.

This pops up every now and then and is complete bullshit. A republic is a system of government with a parliament and an elected head of state. Being a republic and being a democracy are completely unrelated. There are republics that are oligarchies, dictatorships, or democracies. Similarly, there are monarchies that are oligarchies, dictatorships, or democracies.

You can discuss about legitimacy and the fact that the US is a federation of states instead of a government of citizens, but “it’s a republic not a democracy” is stupid. Using it as a way of justifying blatant undemocratic aspects of the way the US work is doubly so.

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