I analyzed SaaS billing dark patterns • Hacker News Board

Re: I analyzed SaaS billing dark patterns

#11

Post by elias94 » Thu, Nov 18, 2021, 9:19 PM UTC

I forgot the AWS password once for an account with only one S3 bucket. I did the recovery procedure but they wanted to verify my identity using my document. I send them my ID, which was with a different address from my account information.

They didn't accept my ID and I wasn't able to stop the service and the recurring payment. Fortunately I registered my payment with a prepaid credit card, so was easy to empty the card and let them billing into the void.

Since then, I always use a prepaid card for recurring payment. It saved my ass in a way.

One of the largest dark pattern is also having a poor customer service.

Re: I analyzed SaaS billing dark patterns

#12

Post by teddyh » Thu, Nov 18, 2021, 9:23 PM UTC

hdjjhhvvhga wrote: post #10

cosmolev wrote: post #4

Subscription-based software is already a dark pattern.

No, I don't think so. If the seller actually incurs monthly costs like hosting, this is absolutely fair. What I would call a dark pattern is when you buy an app, a piece of software that executes code on your device, and are forced to pay monthly fees. This gets more and more common. I understand the reasons, but I personally prefer one-off payments and buy software in this way. If it's good, I will pay for upgrades…

Why does hosting need to be bundled with software upgrade and support? Hint: It doesn’t.

Re: I analyzed SaaS billing dark patterns

#13

Post by dhimes » Thu, Nov 18, 2021, 9:27 PM UTC

human wrote: post #7

hdjjhhvvhga wrote: post #2

> Free trials should not require a credit card. Collecting your payment information is an obvious red flag that you will be billed as soon as the free trial period ends. I remember many people on HN defending this pattern saying that they are not interested in people who don't want to provide their CC details, that they are bad customers, they just want a free ride, and they are not sorry for setting it up like this.…

Requiring a credit card for a trial is fine, as long as you don’t convert automatically to a paying membership. And if you do, please send me a reminder a week before at least.

I'll add: A reminder with an opt-out link.

Re: I analyzed SaaS billing dark patterns

#14

Post by digitalengineer » Thu, Nov 18, 2021, 9:28 PM UTC

Hubspot. The yearly plan is way cheaper. But you need to cancel it 3 months in advance or you’re on the hook for ‘the same period’, thus another year. No reminder email of course.

Re: I analyzed SaaS billing dark patterns

#15

Post by newfonewhodis » Thu, Nov 18, 2021, 9:31 PM UTC

wbobeirne wrote: post #8

cosmolev wrote: post #4

Subscription-based software is already a dark pattern.

What would you recommend products that host the service and have ongoing upkeep costs to do?

I would recommend the creators ask themselves if their software _really_ needs to be hosted or can it be sold as a one-off (self-host or desktop/mobile).

Re: I analyzed SaaS billing dark patterns

#16

Post by notyourday » Thu, Nov 18, 2021, 9:32 PM UTC

> Free trials should not require a credit card.

I'm not in business to provide services to people who want stuff for free permanently. They complain on forums, raise stink and spend nearly no money. They are not my customers. I always ask for a credit card for a free trial. The fewer non-customers signup, the better it is for me.

Re: I analyzed SaaS billing dark patterns

#17

Post by atgarone » Thu, Nov 18, 2021, 9:34 PM UTC

I got locked into a reseller agreement with JustHost for my wife's GSuite account, which she uses for her full-time work. Now I'm paying them $90 a year just so I can retain my GSuite services without her having any downtime or losing her data.

Only recently did I discover GSuite has an FAQ for getting out of reseller agreements. Going to have to act on that.

Re: I analyzed SaaS billing dark patterns

#18

Post by jmsuth » Thu, Nov 18, 2021, 9:42 PM UTC

This is one of my biggest qualms with building SaaS apps on the App Store. You can't do a free trial without requiring an Apple Pay confirmation which will auto-convert. We get lots of negative reviews because of it, but there's no way around it without offering some free version.

Re: I analyzed SaaS billing dark patterns

#19

Post by lgl » Thu, Nov 18, 2021, 9:42 PM UTC

notyourday wrote: post #16

> Free trials should not require a credit card. I'm not in business to provide services to people who want stuff for free permanently. They complain on forums, raise stink and spend nearly no money. They are not my customers. I always ask for a credit card for a free trial. The fewer non-customers signup, the better it is for me.

While I kind of understand your point of view and not all businesses are equal, a free trial is not stuff for free permanently. You should be confident that your product will be able to make the customer willingly add their credit card after their trial is over if you are indeed providing them with a useful service.

Re: I analyzed SaaS billing dark patterns

#20

Post by human » Thu, Nov 18, 2021, 9:43 PM UTC

elliekelly wrote: post #9

rhizome wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Easier bookkeeping on their part.

That might be the reason for the different tiers but there is definitely a dark pattern in the auto-upgrade GP describes. LogMeIn could just as easily put a hard stop at 100 computers with a notification the user needs to upgrade to a higher tier package. Instead they auto-upgrade the user without asking. (I’m assuming there’s no way to avoid the auto-upgrade. It’s one thing if a user opts in to the tier scaling for…

In their defense, I wasn’t auto-upgraded. I just couldn’t add computers anymore. I hovered around 99 for a while, removing old computers, but one day I had to open up my wallet.