1. Embrace 2. Extend
3. Extinguish
4. Go to #1
.NET Hot Reload Support via CLI
11–20 of 267 posts
Re: .NET Hot Reload Support via CLI
#12A hot-button issue gets corrected now, but then they continue to make subtler moves. Why say you love open-source if you keep the juicy bits of Visual Studio Code closed-source? More like you love open-source... for making money. Microsoft is a big company with changing microcultures all the time. They alone as a whole should not take credit for their open-source endeavors. In general, big contributor names should be…
The key difference between the two situation is, that the vs code team does it juicy features as a secret project. Dotnet watch was developed, tested and licensed in the public and stripped out last second.
VS Code behavior you can accept as a open core or commercial plugin thing. The other thing was just a theft.
Re: .NET Hot Reload Support via CLI
#13This is good, but given the amount of terrible decisions in the last few weeks from Microsoft I've lost all trust in them. This will pass, and they'll sneakily do something else. It's clear from the reaction of the well known alt.net people that this problem is strategic, and coming from above. Nothing in this move signifies a change in that strategy.
Weird take IMO. I don’t trust MS and strive to stay away from their products where possible. Their acquisitions of a lot of OSS stuff make that pretty hard these days, though…
But I find it weird to expect perfect decision making out of an organization with hundreds of thousands of employees with a global influence. I don’t know any individuals with perfect decision making skills, so when you take the union of that and add hierarchy, I certainly wouldn’t expect a system of perfection. Especially when perfection is defined by some relative/personal standard.
I agree with your opinions that Microsoft will do weird stuff going forward and that this decision means nothing. It’s also irrelevant to me since I don’t use .NET for absolutely anything.
But if your “trust” in an org is based on them not making “terrible decisions”, I think it may be impossible to actually trust any org. Since inevitably at scale every org will make bad choices. Not criticizing you, just thinking out loud.
Re: .NET Hot Reload Support via CLI
#14Pretty encouraging sign given the drama the last few days. In addition to the community response, it’s pretty clear that a number of dotnet and MSFT team members went to bat hard for this. Really happy to see that they won out.
Encouraging? Microsoft demonstrated here that the move wasn't because of quality or that the change was unable to be in the OSS version, they demonstrated that they only act a certain way because of the backlash. If they would have stand their ground, they would have given the image that this change didn't live up to their wanted quality, instead this demonstrated that they are just giving up to peer-pressure because they don't want to lose "developer love".
Re: .NET Hot Reload Support via CLI
#15It’s nice that they walked back on immediately blowing up the whole .NET ecosystem.
But it’s not like everything is fine again. The Foundation is apparently a bit of a mess and the C# debugger is STILL not available on VScode versions built from source.
That and that they would ever even consider doing this still discourages serious investment into .NET.
Re: .NET Hot Reload Support via CLI
#161. Embrace 2. Extend 3. Extinguish 4. Go to #1
You cannot EEE yourself.
They do a lot of community related crap but this is not EEE.
Re: .NET Hot Reload Support via CLI
#17It’s nice that they walked back on immediately blowing up the whole .NET ecosystem. But it’s not like everything is fine again. The Foundation is apparently a bit of a mess and the C# debugger is STILL not available on VScode versions built from source. That and that they would ever even consider doing this still discourages serious investment into .NET.
That person who messed up just left the foundation btw.
Re: .NET Hot Reload Support via CLI
#18I just wrote a comment on the other post about this. I wonder how this decision was made _behind the scenes_. Either some negotiation happened and the Visual Studio team got some concessions (smaller target?) or it was mandated from the top. Both alternatives do not bode well for the VS team.
in large organizations like these there will always be desync issues, though.
Re: .NET Hot Reload Support via CLI
#19A hot-button issue gets corrected now, but then they continue to make subtler moves. Why say you love open-source if you keep the juicy bits of Visual Studio Code closed-source? More like you love open-source... for making money. Microsoft is a big company with changing microcultures all the time. They alone as a whole should not take credit for their open-source endeavors. In general, big contributor names should be…
I don't understand the complaint when the open-source community seem perfectly happy to provide free labor. That's all it ever was. The rest like like name emphasis is just culture.
Re: .NET Hot Reload Support via CLI
#20This is good, but given the amount of terrible decisions in the last few weeks from Microsoft I've lost all trust in them. This will pass, and they'll sneakily do something else. It's clear from the reaction of the well known alt.net people that this problem is strategic, and coming from above. Nothing in this move signifies a change in that strategy.
as i mentioned elsewhere in the discussion of this post, the chairman or w/e left their position after the debaucle