Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Always Do Extra

bennorthrop.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

11–20 of 129 posts

Re: Always Do Extra

#11

Post by Cerium »

silicon2401 wrote: post #3

Does anybody have good examples of 'extra' work they've done? I agree with the author's assertion that doing extra benefits one a lot more than baseline or more work. It's essentially a way to inject creativity and studying into one's normal work, as opposed to just flat-out working on a different project or straight up studying documentation. That comes with the benefit of being able to show it off in various ways t…

Here is one recent example: My project was to write a script to support a mechanical engineer in life testing some buttons that I interfaced with. The script development went faster than I expected, so with my "extra" time I decided to learn how to use a new testing technique on the project.

Re: Always Do Extra

#12

Post by tomtheelder »

nahnahno wrote: post #10

I completely disagree - do enough, or failing that, nothing. That is enough to solve the well-defined problems. Giving extra to your employer for the same money is a recipe for exploitation. Additionally, “extra” tasks are less defined and therefore more likely to be wasted effort.

This comment does not make sense as a rebuttal to the article.

The author is arguing that you should use spare time you have after doing "enough" on things that enrich, educate, and grow yourself instead of simply doing more of your "normal" work. They state very clearly that they think you should not do additional work items that provide clear value to the business. They are saying you should give extra to yourself, not your employer.

Re: Always Do Extra

#13

Post by tomtheelder »

akarki15 wrote: post #8

i agree that going off-roads from the main task is useful but i disagree with the way the author is suggesting to do it. > Assume there's a reasonable amount of work you need to do to fulfill the base expectations for your job (i.e. your Normal Work) and then there's a little time left over. (I know some may argue this "left-over time" thing, but just go with me) this assumption fails at a lot of companies, especiall…

I think the author's point is "if you have leftover time, do this" not "everyone has leftover time."

Re: Always Do Extra

#14

Post by vkou »

handrous wrote: post #7
silicon2401 wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's actually a great point and a downside to extra work. Maybe the middle ground would be to do extra work for fun and not bring it up, or just finish work early and work on something altogether separate on the side?

Do extra work, and do present it, but pretend it only took 30 minutes when it actually took five hours. Congrats, now you get credit for the extra work and you're a "10x rockstar".

Yes, and the next time a 50-hour task comes up, they'll expect you to do it by tomorrow.

The problem with faking your way into being a 10x rockstar is that expectations grow faster than compensation. The other problem is that if you can't sustain the pace, you're going to burn out and your life will be utter crap.

Re: Always Do Extra

#15

Post by rm445 »

Really interesting article about enabling longevity and success as a software developer, but it matches my view on all kinds of skilled work: whatever your employment arrangement, treat yourself as an old-fashioned professional.

Like a doctor or barrister, more tied to your profession than to one job. You need to be effective in your role, build your reputation by demonstrating your skills are beyond the bare minimum, and continually develop yourself as you go along. Ideally you get lots of win-wins: your 'extra' is a win for the company in the long run, and you come out of it a little wiser, and over time you're more effective due to the effects of past 'extra'. The benefits of these win-wins can be pretty intangible, but they do build up over time.

Re: Always Do Extra

#16

Post by IanCal »

> In the end, I hope it's clear that I'm not arguing that we neglect our Normal Work.

But you are. Choosing extra is choosing to ignore the prioritised work for something you want to do instead.

Just because the estimate was too low this week doesn't suddenly mean there's no more work.

While I think what they describe as Extra is valuable, I think there are reasonable paths to it:

* Get paid by the project, not the hours. Then the time is yours.

* Get buy-in to spend a reasonable amount of time doing "extra" things.

The latter has the obvious benefit of not only happening when people estimate things wrong.

Re: Always Do Extra

#17

Post by handrous »

vkou wrote: post #14
handrous wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do extra work, and do present it, but pretend it only took 30 minutes when it actually took five hours. Congrats, now you get credit for the extra work and you're a "10x rockstar".

Yes, and the next time a 50-hour task comes up, they'll expect you to do it by tomorrow. The problem with faking your way into being a 10x rockstar is that expectations grow faster than compensation. The other problem is that if you can't sustain the pace, you're going to burn out and your life will be utter crap.

I'm pretty sure you're supposed to catapult into doing training and speaking stuff, and "leadership" roles that have you writing blog posts and attending meetings all day while taking credit for what your team is doing, after faking your way to a "10x" reputation.

Re: Always Do Extra

#18

Post by pydry »

While ideal and even natural, I often find that "normal work" usually comes in such fits and starts that it typically make this approach difficult or even impossible.

The most recent time when I had plenty of time and few "normal" stories on my hands there was no normal work to align the extra to. This wasn't as much fun as I thought it'd be. It led to some rather out there "extra" work (from the whole team) that ended up being rather pointless.

There have been a few exceptions where I had really good product managers that ensured a steady work stream that made this possible. Indeed, I found that if the worksteam was steady, it seemed like the obvious thing to do.

Re: Always Do Extra

#19

Post by humbleMouse »

I can’t stand working with people like the OP. He probably sat front row in every class and raised his hand for every teacher’s question too. Cringey, unprofessional... brainwashed. People like OP need to go for a walk outside instead of doing more work.

Re: Always Do Extra

#20

Post by asdfman123 »

swiftcoder wrote: post #2

> It's never something we need to hide, but instead it's something we're eager to share with our teams - ala "hey, I did some research on X, and maybe this is something that could be valuable for us to try". I'll give good odds that in most shops, if you pull this line more than a couple of times, your management chain is going to decide you aren't picking up enough work in sprint planning...

It depends. "Let's change to " is annoying. But if you do a little more research and reframe the problem to make it simpler, that's just good senior dev work.

Understanding the problem and finding what the business really needs instead of diving in.

Post reply on HN