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Renting 'is unaffordable to minimum wage workers in every state,' study finds

money.yahoo.com

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Re: Renting 'is unaffordable to minimum wage workers in every state,' study finds

#11

Post by mandmandam »

bloodyplonker22 wrote: post #6

Minimum wage is not the problem as this article seems to imply. People move up from those starter jobs, they don't stay there forever. The problem is that the politicians and local governments have enacted strict building and zoning laws which disallow for new housing construction. This, in combination with market forces has driven up the price of housing artificially fast.

Minimum wage is absolutely a problem. Maybe not "the" problem, but it's a massive and highly solvable problem which only the profoundly ignorant could possible believe has no effect on low earners ability to rent a roof over their head.

> People move up from those starter jobs, they don't stay there forever.

Please explain to me how that's different from a serf paying off their ownership debt, or a slave winning his freedom by defeating 10 consecutive gladiators.

Re: Renting 'is unaffordable to minimum wage workers in every state,' study finds

#12

Post by leppr »

bloodyplonker22 wrote: post #6

Minimum wage is not the problem as this article seems to imply. People move up from those starter jobs, they don't stay there forever. The problem is that the politicians and local governments have enacted strict building and zoning laws which disallow for new housing construction. This, in combination with market forces has driven up the price of housing artificially fast.

Market forces = unprecedented liquidity injections into the economy increasing inequality faster than ever the past two years. Of course the lower classes are going to struggle. The most ironic part of this is we've had demonstrations against everything except that, yet almost every country in the world has been affected.

Re: Renting 'is unaffordable to minimum wage workers in every state,' study finds

#13

Post by skohan »

bloodyplonker22 wrote: post #6

Minimum wage is not the problem as this article seems to imply. People move up from those starter jobs, they don't stay there forever. The problem is that the politicians and local governments have enacted strict building and zoning laws which disallow for new housing construction. This, in combination with market forces has driven up the price of housing artificially fast.

I think it's a combination of factors. More home building would help, but also regulating housing speculation might be a good idea.

Re: Renting 'is unaffordable to minimum wage workers in every state,' study finds

#14

Post by jquery »

jokoon wrote: post #4

I'm not american and yahoo has a cookie wall. How exactly are those people managing to survive? My country has welfare that allows people to pay rent and food. I'm not really aware of how american welfare works, but I guess it varies a lot between states?

Room sharing in my experience of being poor is the most common way to make it.

Re: Renting 'is unaffordable to minimum wage workers in every state,' study finds

#15

Post by incone123 »

thevagrant wrote: post #5
jokoon wrote: post #4

I'm not american and yahoo has a cookie wall. How exactly are those people managing to survive? My country has welfare that allows people to pay rent and food. I'm not really aware of how american welfare works, but I guess it varies a lot between states?

I don't know answer but these spring to mind: Debt, overtime, multiple jobs, overcrowding, subletting rooms.

Also people who are street homeless or living in their cars, but in many cases still holding down jobs.

Re: Renting 'is unaffordable to minimum wage workers in every state,' study finds

#16

Post by ravenstine »

DoreenMichele wrote: post #9
thevagrant wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know answer but these spring to mind: Debt, overtime, multiple jobs, overcrowding, subletting rooms.

America also has a lot of homelessness. Yes, there are homeless people with jobs, contrary to what most people seem to think.

People underestimate the percentage of homeless who live in their cars and shower at the gym, and aren't just the unwashed "bums" sleeping on benches.

Re: Renting 'is unaffordable to minimum wage workers in every state,' study finds

#17

Post by trainsplanes »

bloodyplonker22 wrote: post #6

Minimum wage is not the problem as this article seems to imply. People move up from those starter jobs, they don't stay there forever. The problem is that the politicians and local governments have enacted strict building and zoning laws which disallow for new housing construction. This, in combination with market forces has driven up the price of housing artificially fast.

> People move up from those starter jobs, they don't stay there forever.

The domain of “starter jobs” is rapidly expanding. It used to just be fry cooks at burger chains as well as newspaper boys, and before that we had farmhands, but now everything is a “starter job” that barely pays enough for rent if it does at all.

Basically the entirety of retail is a starter job. Even retail management barely pays enough to live. Delivery jobs are starter jobs. Customer support jobs are starter jobs. Work at a retirement home? Starter job. Many repair jobs are starter jobs. And plenty more.

You’ll see people 30, 40, 50 years old working these jobs. Still struggling.

Re: Renting 'is unaffordable to minimum wage workers in every state,' study finds

#18

Post by leppr »

mandmandam wrote: post #11
bloodyplonker22 wrote: post #6

Minimum wage is not the problem as this article seems to imply. People move up from those starter jobs, they don't stay there forever. The problem is that the politicians and local governments have enacted strict building and zoning laws which disallow for new housing construction. This, in combination with market forces has driven up the price of housing artificially fast.

Minimum wage is absolutely a problem. Maybe not "the" problem, but it's a massive and highly solvable problem which only the profoundly ignorant could possible believe has no effect on low earners ability to rent a roof over their head. > People move up from those starter jobs, they don't stay there forever. Please explain to me how that's different from a serf paying off their ownership debt, or a slave winning his…

Why would there not be a market for housing people with low wages? There are markets for cheap food, cheap clothes, cheap entertainment, ... Everything except lodging.

There's a hiccup somewhere in the "free market" of many countries that prevents it from providing cheap housing, even though there's clearly a huge business opportunity.

Re: Renting 'is unaffordable to minimum wage workers in every state,' study finds

#19

Post by [deleted] »

ravenstine wrote: post #16
DoreenMichele wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

America also has a lot of homelessness. Yes, there are homeless people with jobs, contrary to what most people seem to think.

People underestimate the percentage of homeless who live in their cars and shower at the gym, and aren't just the unwashed "bums" sleeping on benches.

[deleted]

Re: Renting 'is unaffordable to minimum wage workers in every state,' study finds

#20

Post by skohan »

strictfp wrote: post #7
dijit wrote: post #3

I’m not entirely sure how we got to this place but it definitely feels this way in the UK too at times, though the circumstances might be different. Housing as an absolute expense has risen faster than income in nearly every developed country that I can think of. But, something that I always bring up when minimum wage is mentioned as a panacea: Sweden does not have a federally mandated minimum wage, but people are pa…

I live in Sweden and I can tell you that it's not so clear-cut. Rent control means that people have to queue for many years for decent rental apartments. We also have a lot of black market labour. The unions have historically had a strong grip, but are under attack by political forces that want to undermine that market with unskilled workers. And on top of all this I think that people simply always prioritize living…

Imo some level degree of rent control is needed to prevent forces like housing speculation from causing housing prices to spike wildly in certain market conditions. Otherwise you end up with SF where it's impossible for anyone but the highest income earners to even exist.

I think the vienna model seems to have been fairly successful: if you build lots of high-quality public housing, the incentive structure is good for putting roofs over people's heads in an affordable way.

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