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Why the Covid Vaccines Aren’t Dangerous

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Re: Why the Covid Vaccines Aren’t Dangerous

#11

Post by Aachen »

void_mint wrote: post #4

Those that believe the vaccines are dangerous aren't swayed by rational thinking.

- Citation needed, I'm not so sure you can make this off-hand remark and we should all accept it as an axiom and continue from here. Many people will be reasonable given reasonable arguments, especially if you make the time to answer questions and concerns they have. I've noticed people don't do research on their own, almost never aside from a very small share of my friends and family, so individual conversations seem essential to me when they aren't clear on something.

- For the sake of argument perhaps, even if that were true, what do you propose then? Let them be, force them, make irrational arguments (i.e. lie), something else?

Re: Why the Covid Vaccines Aren’t Dangerous

#14

Post by hammock »

void_mint wrote: post #4

Those that believe the vaccines are dangerous aren't swayed by rational thinking.

I was told I wasn't supposed to use rational thinking?

>"Research both sides and make up your own mind." It’s simple, straightforward, common sense advice. And when it comes to issues like vaccinations, climate change, and the novel coronavirus SARS-CoV-2, it can be dangerous, destructive, and even deadly.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/startswithabang/2020/07/30/you-...

Re: Why the Covid Vaccines Aren’t Dangerous

#15

Post by mjevans »

7thaccount wrote: post #10
void_mint wrote: post #4

Those that believe the vaccines are dangerous aren't swayed by rational thinking.

My mother falls into this category and lives in a very high infection area. Won't wear a mask, won't social distance, and won't get the "Satan vaccine". She's convinced it will kill her despite the rest of the family having got the vaccine with no ill effects. It's definitely strained the relationship. I told them they could visit me and their grandkids as soon as they got vaccinated. Apparently "sticking it to the l…

About 3 months after 0+ are eligible for a vaccine that works I will stop giving a crap about others. I will still wear a mask for myself just as an added layer of protection, but I'll cease caring about saving those who do not want to be saved.

Re: Why the Covid Vaccines Aren’t Dangerous

#16

Post by hammock »

>It is this weighing of risks and benefits, in all their many facets, that informs the chorus of health-care professionals imploring their families, neighbors, co-workers, and friends, along with everyone else, to please get vaccinated against covid-19. They urge vaccination because they see its ratio of risks to benefits as incredibly, unbelievably good.

For someone who has already had Covid and recovered, there is no benefit. Only risk.[1] But they are not allowed to make this calculation for themselves and instead are treated to constant social pressure campaigns like this piece.

[1]https://www.news-medical.net/news/20210608/No-point-vaccinat...

Re: Why the Covid Vaccines Aren’t Dangerous

#17

Post by User23 »

void_mint wrote: post #4

Those that believe the vaccines are dangerous aren't swayed by rational thinking.

Being dishonest isn't a hallmark of rational thinking either. The Covid-19 vaccines are observably dangerous to some persons[1], however rare that danger may be. The rational thing to do is to weigh the risk versus the benefit. If you really want hesitant persons to get vaccinated, you're going to get a lot farther by being honest about the risks of the vaccines, the risks of Covid-19, and showing why, for their circumstances, getting the vaccine is the correct risk management strategy. And frankly, for young persons with acquired natural immunity, the risk of myocarditis and other adverse effects isn't worth it for a disease they are already immune to.

And I'm going to annoy people by saying that. I'm baffled why the existence of natural immunity, which is completely settled science, has somehow become controversial. If the mechanism for natural immunity didn't work, then the mechanism for vaccinated immunity also wouldn't be able to work. Believing that the vaccines can work but the immune system response to the live virus doesn't is some serious irrationality.

Edit: And the response is a wonderful demonstration of Aristotle's ancient observation that those in the grips of fear cannot be persuaded by facts or reason.

[1] https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/safety/va...

Re: Why the Covid Vaccines Aren’t Dangerous

#18

Post by sharken »

mjevans wrote: post #15
7thaccount wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My mother falls into this category and lives in a very high infection area. Won't wear a mask, won't social distance, and won't get the "Satan vaccine". She's convinced it will kill her despite the rest of the family having got the vaccine with no ill effects. It's definitely strained the relationship. I told them they could visit me and their grandkids as soon as they got vaccinated. Apparently "sticking it to the l…

About 3 months after 0+ are eligible for a vaccine that works I will stop giving a crap about others. I will still wear a mask for myself just as an added layer of protection, but I'll cease caring about saving those who do not want to be saved.

So how do you feel about the alcoholics and obese, do you also not care about them ?

Re: Why the Covid Vaccines Aren’t Dangerous

#19

Post by hammock »

mjevans wrote: post #15
7thaccount wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My mother falls into this category and lives in a very high infection area. Won't wear a mask, won't social distance, and won't get the "Satan vaccine". She's convinced it will kill her despite the rest of the family having got the vaccine with no ill effects. It's definitely strained the relationship. I told them they could visit me and their grandkids as soon as they got vaccinated. Apparently "sticking it to the l…

About 3 months after 0+ are eligible for a vaccine that works I will stop giving a crap about others. I will still wear a mask for myself just as an added layer of protection, but I'll cease caring about saving those who do not want to be saved.

You will leave the unvaccinated alone once everyone who wants to get it can? You will let them in restaurants and on planes?

Re: Why the Covid Vaccines Aren’t Dangerous

#20

Post by rdli »

hammock wrote: post #16

>It is this weighing of risks and benefits, in all their many facets, that informs the chorus of health-care professionals imploring their families, neighbors, co-workers, and friends, along with everyone else, to please get vaccinated against covid-19. They urge vaccination because they see its ratio of risks to benefits as incredibly, unbelievably good. For someone who has already had Covid and recovered, there is…

This study is based on 2020 data, pre Delta.
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