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Temozolomide Is Explosive

blogs.sciencemag.org

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Re: Temozolomide Is Explosive

#11

Post by throwaway0a5e »

lmilcin wrote: post #10

I mean, seriously, just look at the molecule. All those nitrogen atoms lying there restless to each go their own separate way:) I would be surprised if it wasn't.

At a bare minimum it'd probably be a damn good oxidizer at which point you're 80% of the way to a good explosive.

Re: Temozolomide Is Explosive

#12

Post by munificent »

dylan604 wrote: post #7

"What they found was rapid onset of decomposition at 170 degrees" So this seems to be more about people in a lab situation rather than it being so unstable it reacting sitting in someone's hot car. Suspecting it to react at 212 and finding it reacting at 170 could ruin a lab tech's day to be sure. Those are the jobs that sound fun "for the science" lets see what happens when...

I think you're overlooking the most important scenario: mass production of it in a factory setting.

Re: Temozolomide Is Explosive

#13

Post by vibrio »

azinman2 wrote: post #6

Chemotherapy is basically cave man medicine. That a therapeutic drug is explosive only adds to that sentiment. The idea that we'll basically poison you just up to a point that's nearly fatal in order to kill the cancer is such a terrible way to treat someone. Now I'm not saying don't ever do it -- unfortunately that's where we're at in 2021. It's just kind of unbelievable that cancer remains so elusive that we're sti…

I agree with your wine-drinking physicians on clinical trial participation, and your question on how to improve broader participation. I also believe that there are fundamental difference in cancers that arrive in a young person versus cancers that have slowly evolved in the patients bodies, perhaps over a decade or more-the latter are likely much more stubborn.

Re: Temozolomide Is Explosive

#14

Post by mabbo »

lmilcin wrote: post #10

I mean, seriously, just look at the molecule. All those nitrogen atoms lying there restless to each go their own separate way:) I would be surprised if it wasn't.

As someone who dropped chemistry in grade 11- what makes Nitrogen so exciting like that?

So many common explosive compounds seem to have it.

Re: Temozolomide Is Explosive

#15

Post by robbiep »

azinman2 wrote: post #6

Chemotherapy is basically cave man medicine. That a therapeutic drug is explosive only adds to that sentiment. The idea that we'll basically poison you just up to a point that's nearly fatal in order to kill the cancer is such a terrible way to treat someone. Now I'm not saying don't ever do it -- unfortunately that's where we're at in 2021. It's just kind of unbelievable that cancer remains so elusive that we're sti…

The cancers that are treated successfully in children are the blood borne ones (mostly leukemias) and generally because they’re easier to wipe out and replace the marrow with. Some Childhood brain tumours are also very successfully treated, and most other adult cancers children don’t get. Sarcomas still kill people left right and centre though.

The truth is that we’re already peeking out of the dark ages of chemotherapy. Immunothérapies have revolutionised the field and new stuff coming online is incredible. When I started medical school 11 years ago the 5 year survival of metastatic melanoma was close to 0%. It’s now close to the population average (well, not really, but it’s greater than 50%). Records are being smashed

Re: Temozolomide Is Explosive

#16

Post by ashtonkem »

Kind of surprising nobody thought to check until now. Even as a non chemist (albeit a regular reader of Derek Lowe), I look at that and say “boy is that a lot of nitrogens, I wonder if they’re itching to become an expanding cloud of hot nitrogen gas and broken lab equipment”.

Re: Temozolomide Is Explosive

#17

Post by ISL »

munificent wrote: post #12
dylan604 wrote: post #7

"What they found was rapid onset of decomposition at 170 degrees" So this seems to be more about people in a lab situation rather than it being so unstable it reacting sitting in someone's hot car. Suspecting it to react at 212 and finding it reacting at 170 could ruin a lab tech's day to be sure. Those are the jobs that sound fun "for the science" lets see what happens when...

I think you're overlooking the most important scenario: mass production of it in a factory setting.

And just handling/storage. Things that are flammable or explosive have more-stringent requirements.

A familiar example: one should take much greater care when storing rubbing alcohol (or Bacardi 151 or vodka) than wine. One will magnify a house-fire. The other will help to douse a flame.

Re: Temozolomide Is Explosive

#19

Post by Thorondor »

mabbo wrote: post #14
lmilcin wrote: post #10

I mean, seriously, just look at the molecule. All those nitrogen atoms lying there restless to each go their own separate way:) I would be surprised if it wasn't.

As someone who dropped chemistry in grade 11- what makes Nitrogen so exciting like that? So many common explosive compounds seem to have it.

When nitrogen compounds combust, they tend to produce nitrogen gas (N2). Since nitrogen molecules contain a very strong nitrogen-nitrogen triple bond, a lot of energy is released when they form.

Re: Temozolomide Is Explosive

#20

Post by mcguire »

"You could say that TMZ is a prodrug for a prodrug for methyldiazonium, which is never going to be a drug that can just be administered by itself. ... temozolimide is genotoxic and tetratogenic, so it has to be handled carefully, but honestly, anything that generates a small diazonium compound so readily is going to be similarly hazardous. ... Indeed, drop-hammer tests showed that these TMZ samples decompose suddenly with smoke on impact."

So, uh, what are the explosive decomposition products?

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