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Safari 15 on Mac OS, a user interface mess

morrick.me

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Re: Safari 15 on Mac OS, a user interface mess

#11
Linked article refers to the changes in Safari as "thoughtless UI", which is a fairly common argument used against changes that people don't like. Against Apple, Microsoft, WinAmp, Reddit, etc.

But let's be fair and note that there quite certainly a lot of very proud, considerate, intentional designers and developers who are behind this change. People who probably put thousands (millions?) multiples of "thought" in considering the changes, versus someone saying "Whoa...this is different and I don't like different." The whine about site colors bleeding into the chrome seem particularly subjective, yet they're presented as if they're objective truths.

I use a macOS beta 15 device beside a 14 device, all day every day. At first install it was jarring, but then I became acclimated to it and it's fine. Tab groups are fantastic. I appreciate the aesthetics of chrome bleed, but that's just my subjective opinion. My only complaint about the browser is that it's crash-prone right now.

Re: Safari 15 on Mac OS, a user interface mess

#12
post #3

The updated Safari has had a baffling UI update. It does not make any sense at all, on THE most important application that's shipped with the operating system. It's those kind of UI ideas that look great on a mockup, but do not work in reality with real data and real users, those that open 35 tabs—behaviour encouraged by macOS windowing system by the way—and now all of those are crammed into a ludicrously small space…

I think their hoping tab groups will reduce the 35 tab situation, but it’s too hard to organise when in information gathering mode. I hope they put a preference option to go back to the current interface. I’ll be filing a bug report.

Re: Safari 15 on Mac OS, a user interface mess

#13
I love Apple and Safari and frequently provide bug reports to WebKit but I also absolutely hate the new safari and hope they reconsider it. I don’t mind change that is for the better and simply requires time to change muscle memory but this requires that and the end result is more clicks to do things, fewer static targets and the supposive benefits aren’t benefits for me at least. I find it most awful on iOS. The WebKit team is great and have to assume this direction to make the chrome of the app even smaller came from higher up. Hopefully more public backlash when the public betas come out so apple can rethink it. At the end of the day it’s still better than the alternatives for my use cases but hate that for me it’s a worse experience for something I use more than any other app.

Re: Safari 15 on Mac OS, a user interface mess

#14
This weird user interface décisions also completely negate all that talk about speed. On iOS you now have to tap through a submenu with animations to do anything. (Share, Private Mode, Reading list…) the tab groups are useless as they are also hidden behind more taps (on Mac having multiple windows makes way more sense anyways, maybe let people name those or somehow see them grouped in the current open pages view on the bottom). Every action now feels slower, because even if the page loads 10ms faster than in another browser, any useful interaction will end up in hundreds of milliseconds of animations.

Re: Safari 15 on Mac OS, a user interface mess

#15

Linked article refers to the changes in Safari as "thoughtless UI", which is a fairly common argument used against changes that people don't like. Against Apple, Microsoft, WinAmp, Reddit, etc. But let's be fair and note that there quite certainly a lot of very proud, considerate, intentional designers and developers who are behind this change. People who probably put thousands (millions?) multiples of "thought" in c…

> People who probably put thousands (millions?) multiples of "thought" in considering the changes

Thoughts maybe, but did they ask users what they wanted? Did they run usability studies to verify that these changes make sense? I can't imagine that they did. Certain UI changes in macOS, Windows, etc. are so obviously bad (and are eventually changed) that no matter how much they thought about it, they didn't care to check what users thought.

Re: Safari 15 on Mac OS, a user interface mess

#16
post #5

“ And it makes no sense whatsoever that one would want to go looking for the Reload button in a tiny menu with a More… icon.” I don’t even remember when was the last time I clicked the reload button. I just press command + R.

Yeah, to me much of this sounds great. No menu bar? Great, I never use it. Keyboard shortcuts make it unnecessary. No reload button? Great, one less thing I don’t use cluttering up the UI.

I understand that less experienced users may find this confusing though. Although saying that i think anyone can learn Cmd-R and Cmd-W, and would be better off for it.

I agree with the article on the tab/address bar merge being bad though.

Re: Safari 15 on Mac OS, a user interface mess

#17

The new tab/address bar thing could be the reason I switch back away from Safari after using it as my main browser for a few years due to its energy efficiency compared to Firefox and Chrome. What UI designer thought taking away more space for the tab bar was a good idea? Does that person even use a web browser?

Do you honestly think this is a one-person job? While you might question the outcome of product development, assuming that a multi-billion R&D budget accounts for 1 designer is just unhelpful.

Even just the WebKit commits with Apple engineering contacts is enough to build a whole company around...

Re: Safari 15 on Mac OS, a user interface mess

#18
post #14

This weird user interface décisions also completely negate all that talk about speed. On iOS you now have to tap through a submenu with animations to do anything. (Share, Private Mode, Reading list…) the tab groups are useless as they are also hidden behind more taps (on Mac having multiple windows makes way more sense anyways, maybe let people name those or somehow see them grouped in the current open pages view on…

Does the “reduce animations” accessibility toggle help at all here?

Re: Safari 15 on Mac OS, a user interface mess

#19
Tabs are imperative to web productivity.

On Google Chrome since tabs are on their own row at the top of the window and maintain their size and position you can fling your mouse to the top of the screen easily hit them. On Safari since the address bar expands from the active tab, the size and position of the tabs are drastically changing. This makes selecting a tab more difficult. Additionally, since the size the address bar is wider the distance your mouse has to travel to select the neighbouring tab increases.

In the end this leads to more effort and bad ergonomics. I would love it if they just had the tabs on one row and address bar one row, until then I will stick with chrome on the desktop.

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