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We are desensitized to Christianity’s influence on Western thought

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Re: We are desensitized to Christianity’s influence on Western thought

#11

Post by gggggggaaa »

markemer wrote: post #5

Yeah, this is a load of nonsense. The worst part is this essays ahistorical line of thinking. Like highlighting the Romans bad behavior without examining things like the crusades and chattel slavery which used Christianity as a defense. And it’s Christian supremacist since he leaves out the Jews, Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists, and any other religion that believes in human rights.

>And it’s Christian supremacist since he leaves out the Jews, Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists, and any other religion that believes in human rights.

What does it mean for a religion to believe in "human rights" and why is the belief in "human rights" a hallmark of superiority in your view?

Re: We are desensitized to Christianity’s influence on Western thought

#13

Post by Udik »

I was reading this essay nodding, until the revelation: the author isn't Christian at all. He's raised in Judaism. My knowledge of religion (despite being born and raised in a Catholic country) is entirely intuitive, but Judaism and Christianity seem pretty different religions, and the Old and New Testament contain different teachings and a different worldview. At the very least it could be lexical sloppiness (Christianity as a catch-all term for the three Abrahamic religions, since he mentions mosques too at some point). Curious.

I guess this confusion between Christianity and Judaism is pretty typical of American culture. For example, this is an interesting article from the Jerusalem Post about the progressive Judaization of US's Pentecostals:

https://m.jpost.com/magazine/the-new-judaizers-540415

Re: We are desensitized to Christianity’s influence on Western thought

#14

Post by netfortius »

Delusion is delusion, however one wants to call it in religious terms, e.g. christianity, islamism, etc. Attempt to apply some rationality to such, regardless of the topic, is simply ridiculous. But - hey! - let's just have another blog, just in case...

Re: We are desensitized to Christianity’s influence on Western thought

#15

Post by throwaway210222 »

nottorp wrote: post #7
HenryKissinger wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't believe in God, but this is historically correct. The Universal Declaration on Human Rights as conceived by the United Nations traces its roots to the 1789 Declaration of the Rights of Man and of the Citizen that was a product of the French revolution. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Declaration_of_the_Rights_of... The preamble of this document directly references God: > In consequence, the National Assembly…

That's a declaration. Which apart from mentioning a supreme being (not the Christian god) has its roots in other concepts. However, the article is typical Christian propaganda insinuating that atheists are amoral and you need the benevolent guidance of a supernatural being (and its church) to behave like a decent human being.

> you need the benevolent guidance of a supernatural being… to behave like a decent human being.

which is precisely why an atheist's morals are superior: they thought it through and convinced themselves that human rights is the better path.

Religious people by definition only do it [their words] because their deity says so.

Which is precisely why its so simple for the same benevolent guidance of a supernatural being to equally justify - inter alia - crusades, jihads, fatwas and honour killings.

Re: We are desensitized to Christianity’s influence on Western thought

#17

Post by hitekker »

This passage from the "Wisdom of Insecurity" by Alan Watts sheds more light on the concept of "surrendering knowledge" as a way to realize truth:

> The discovery of this reality is hindered rather than helped by belief, whether one believes in God or believes in atheism. We must here make a clear distinction between belief and faith, because, in general practice, belief has come to mean a state of mind which is almost the opposite of faith. Belief, as I use the word here, is the insistence that the truth is what one would “lief” or wish it to be. The believer will open his mind to the truth on condition that it fits in with his preconceived ideas and wishes. Faith, on the other hand, is an unreserved opening of the mind to the truth, whatever it may turn out to be. Faith has no preconceptions; it is a plunge into the unknown. Belief clings, but faith lets go. In this sense of the word, faith is the essential virtue of science, and likewise of any religion that is not self-deception.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fideism covers a similar topic.

Re: We are desensitized to Christianity’s influence on Western thought

#18

Post by dragonwriter »

> The original Constitution says that our “unalienable rights” are a result not of secular rationalism, but rather an omnipotent God who endows us with those rights.

No, it doesn’t. The author confuses apropaganda document (the Declaration of Independence, which still doesn’t make this specific claim—it does reference rights being endowed by a Creator, but does not specifically attribute omnipotence to that Creator) with a governing document (which comes nowhere close, making only a vague reference to the “blessings of liberty” in its preamble.)

> To that end, the pillars of American law rest as much on the Bible as on the writings of Enlightenment thinkers.

Even aside from the content supporting this not being in the document in question at all, “As much as” is trivially false; the authors of the Constitution were Enlightenment thinkers themselves, so if it had any Biblical influence at all, it could only be subordinate to and by way of Enlightenment thinkers.

> When it comes to space, “The West” is any place to the West of where Christ was crucified.

No, while it was a Christian geographic reference before being replaced with a Cold War one, the reference was to the geography where the dominant religion after the East-West Schism was Roman Catholic.

Re: We are desensitized to Christianity’s influence on Western thought

#19

Post by Udik »

permo-w wrote: post #16

> “The West” is any place to the West of where Christ was crucified. This … isn’t true? Maybe a few hundred years ago that was the case, but since World War 2, The West means west of the Iron Curtain

The Middle East (where Jesus was born and crucified) doesn't have anything to do with the Iron Curtain and is, quite obviously, not the center either.

Re: We are desensitized to Christianity’s influence on Western thought

#20

Post by permo-w »

Udik wrote: post #19
permo-w wrote: post #16

> “The West” is any place to the West of where Christ was crucified. This … isn’t true? Maybe a few hundred years ago that was the case, but since World War 2, The West means west of the Iron Curtain

The Middle East (where Jesus was born and crucified) doesn't have anything to do with the Iron Curtain and is, quite obviously, not the center either.

I didn’t say anything about the East. I commented on what is regarded as The West
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