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NHS Covid-19 app update blocked for breaking Apple and Google's rules

bbc.co.uk

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Re: NHS Covid-19 app update blocked for breaking Apple and Google's rules

#11

Post by mbalyuzi »

cameronh90 wrote: post #4

Irrespective of ones own feelings about this particular app: isn't it interesting that Google and Apple have the power to collect all our location data, but can refuse our democratic governments access to that data even on a voluntary basis?

I find it interesting that there seems to be a (wilful?) ignorance on the part of our government as to quite how big and powerful those corporations are.

There seems to be a bit of a "We're the government, so they'll have to do what we ask/tell" going on here I suspect. Probably coupled with incompetent IT project management that didn't bother to worry about the terms and conditions they signed up to, because that was too hard.

Re: NHS Covid-19 app update blocked for breaking Apple and Google's rules

#13

Post by ditn »

bellyfullofbac wrote: post #7

Gotta love the images of the overly complex QR codes... Hey devs, stop packing so much info on those things!

You might like this then - turns out the QR codes are a cluster https://www.revk.uk/2020/09/how-not-to-qr-nhs-c19-app.html

Re: NHS Covid-19 app update blocked for breaking Apple and Google's rules

#14

Post by ircshotty »

cameronh90 wrote: post #4

Irrespective of ones own feelings about this particular app: isn't it interesting that Google and Apple have the power to collect all our location data, but can refuse our democratic governments access to that data even on a voluntary basis?

Can't speak for Google's case - but Apple certainly goes to great pains to make it clear they don't collect location data on users - it's left on the user's device.

Isn't it interesting that it takes an international mega-corporation to take a more realistic and principled approach to user privacy than a democratic government.

Re: NHS Covid-19 app update blocked for breaking Apple and Google's rules

#15

Post by cameronh90 »

Hamuko wrote: post #5
cameronh90 wrote: post #4

Irrespective of ones own feelings about this particular app: isn't it interesting that Google and Apple have the power to collect all our location data, but can refuse our democratic governments access to that data even on a voluntary basis?

Apple and Google are just upholding their part of the agreement.

I'm not sure you can call it an agreement in any true sense. Apple and Google dictated the terms for accessing the Bluetooth hardware in the particular way required. Many governments around the world wanted more direct access to the hardware than Apple/Google have permitted, or (voluntary or otherwise) access to location data. Google and Apple said if you don't agree to these terms, you don't get to access anything.

I'm not necessarily saying that's wrong or right. You could argue they're defending the user's rights against the tyranny of the British government. Or you could say they're constraining the user's and their democratically elected government's rights to voluntarily use data to help end a pandemic, while at the same time profiting off it themselves.

Re: NHS Covid-19 app update blocked for breaking Apple and Google's rules

#17

Post by dkarp »

bellyfullofbac wrote: post #7

Gotta love the images of the overly complex QR codes... Hey devs, stop packing so much info on those things!

I was curious what it was sending so scanned it:

UKC19TRACING:1:eyJhbGciOiJFUzI1NiIsImtpZCI6ImlSNHdIVEIxdkF2a 2RjbEdCQWVwUlpxSzZSb29GbVNxcEpDQVd4alFvUFEifQ.eyJpZCI6IlA1Mkt XUFIzIiwidHlwIjoiZW50cnkiLCJvcG4iOiJFbncgTGxlb2xpYWQgeSBQcmF3 ZiIsImFkciI6IldlbHNoIEdvdmVybm1lbnRcbkNyb3duIEJ1aWxkaW5nXG5DY XRoYXlzIFBhcmtcbkNBUkRJRkYsIENGMTAgM05RIiwicHQiOiJDQVJESUZGIi wicGMiOiJDRjEwM05RIiwidnQiOiIwMDEifQ.3USKQlzdD4_RlH-wWvPPyQig 3tGbS8XUIFlTryqVzCmeWzc32YyKLjYpnzNOpUu0555-ym1kfvdDNAqnqyAWRw

The first part "UKC19TRACING" obviously tells you it's for UK Covid 19 tracing. The second part "1" is maybe a version number. The rest is a json web token with the following payload:

{"id":"P52KWPR3","typ":"entry","opn":"Enw Lleoliad y Prawf","adr":"Welsh Government\nCrown Building\nCathays Park\nCARDIFF, CF10 3NQ","pt":"CARDIFF","pc":"CF103NQ","vt":"001"}

Honestly, this seems to me to be overly complicated but I don't really know how the apps work.

Re: NHS Covid-19 app update blocked for breaking Apple and Google's rules

#18

Post by cameronh90 »

ircshotty wrote: post #14
cameronh90 wrote: post #4

Irrespective of ones own feelings about this particular app: isn't it interesting that Google and Apple have the power to collect all our location data, but can refuse our democratic governments access to that data even on a voluntary basis?

Can't speak for Google's case - but Apple certainly goes to great pains to make it clear they don't collect location data on users - it's left on the user's device. Isn't it interesting that it takes an international mega-corporation to take a more realistic and principled approach to user privacy than a democratic government.

Apple definitely have a stronger case here, because as you say, they do more generally go to lengths to protect user privacy. That being said, they do use location-based advertising themselves.

Re: NHS Covid-19 app update blocked for breaking Apple and Google's rules

#19

Post by mytailorisrich »

mbalyuzi wrote: post #11
cameronh90 wrote: post #4

Irrespective of ones own feelings about this particular app: isn't it interesting that Google and Apple have the power to collect all our location data, but can refuse our democratic governments access to that data even on a voluntary basis?

I find it interesting that there seems to be a (wilful?) ignorance on the part of our government as to quite how big and powerful those corporations are. There seems to be a bit of a "We're the government, so they'll have to do what we ask/tell" going on here I suspect. Probably coupled with incompetent IT project management that didn't bother to worry about the terms and conditions they signed up to, because that wa…

> There seems to be a bit of a "We're the government, so they'll have to do what we ask/tell" going on here I suspect

That's the case (they are the government, they are in control, not Apple or Google), and certainly it should have been the case considering the situation. But that would have required the government to show some backbone and to use the power at its disposal. Instead it seems that the issue has been politically controversial so that the government decided not to act decisively on track and trace apps overall.

This is continuing with the controversy over "vaccine passports".

Re: NHS Covid-19 app update blocked for breaking Apple and Google's rules

#20

Post by dustinmoris »

ircshotty wrote: post #14
cameronh90 wrote: post #4

Irrespective of ones own feelings about this particular app: isn't it interesting that Google and Apple have the power to collect all our location data, but can refuse our democratic governments access to that data even on a voluntary basis?

Can't speak for Google's case - but Apple certainly goes to great pains to make it clear they don't collect location data on users - it's left on the user's device. Isn't it interesting that it takes an international mega-corporation to take a more realistic and principled approach to user privacy than a democratic government.

Well put! These are the moments which everyone remembers and refers back to when the next troll comes along and claims that Apple must allow third party app stores.
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