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Study: All non-violent criminals jailed on minor drug offence should be released

newkerala.com

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Re: Study: All non-violent criminals jailed on minor drug offence should be released

#11

Post by at_a_remove »

whiddershins wrote: post #2

First of all, I basically agree with this. Here’s something I don’t know: Sometimes I wonder whether some people in prison for non-violent drug offenses did a plea bargain down from a violent offense. And if that were the case, should this affect our opinion on any of this?

I agree. It needs a little more nuance, especially the plea bargaining. And on top of that, prosecutors are known to pile on tons of only vaguely-applicable, probably-not-convictable charges just to get someone to plea bargain down, so that complicates even the plea bargain exception.

I'll throw in another part where more fine-grained control would be nice: the amount of said substances is measured by gross weight, baggie included, even if whatever the substance is has been "stepped on."

Now, wave a gun in someone's face to take their money for drugs? Keep that charge. But otherwise we should not only free, but expunge the record, retroactively. Some kid with a dime bag ends up having to suffer for that decision for the rest of their life.

Re: Study: All non-violent criminals jailed on minor drug offence should be released

#12

Post by pmiller2 »

throwaway0a5e wrote: post #8
pmiller2 wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What would you consider a "violent drug offense"? Or, am I misreading your question?

It's easy to see how pistol whipping someone over a bad drug deal could be plead down to a non-violent possession/dealing offense because proving assault and battery is hard when the prosecution only has testimony and circumstantial evidence the prosecution's star witness is an addict with a mile long record. Possession is very easy to prove. A&B, DV, etc, etc are much harder to prosecute (and by "much" I mean "some…

But, neither assault nor battery are drug offenses.

Re: Study: All non-violent criminals jailed on minor drug offence should be released

#13

Post by quotemstr »

oytis wrote: post #5

A study (if it's a real study) can't tell you what should be done, it should give you new knowledge about the state of affairs. (while I agree that drug offense should be decriminalized).

Exactly. Any form of science cannot tell us what should or should not be done. Science informs our choices. It doesn't make them.

Re: Study: All non-violent criminals jailed on minor drug offence should be released

#14

Post by leetcrew »

whiddershins wrote: post #2

First of all, I basically agree with this. Here’s something I don’t know: Sometimes I wonder whether some people in prison for non-violent drug offenses did a plea bargain down from a violent offense. And if that were the case, should this affect our opinion on any of this?

that's a good question, but I don't think there's a good way to distinguish between people who pled down from charges they likely would have been convicted on at trial and charges that were heaped on for leverage but had little chance of sticking. from a criminal justice perspective, I think we need to consider only the actual convictions. we might take into consideration whether there are any meaningful priors though.

Re: Study: All non-violent criminals jailed on minor drug offence should be released

#16

Post by rwmurrayVT »

whiddershins wrote: post #2

First of all, I basically agree with this. Here’s something I don’t know: Sometimes I wonder whether some people in prison for non-violent drug offenses did a plea bargain down from a violent offense. And if that were the case, should this affect our opinion on any of this?

On the federal level in the USA that is not possible. Firearms and violence add on points to your sentencing and are often linked with mandatory minimums. Firearms in particular really tank your chances of a short sentence. Prior to the First Step Act you couldn't even participate in RDAP with a firearm linked to your crime.

I outlined this in a different comment, but programming like RDAP should be developed and standardized to aide convicted in rehabilitation.

Re: Study: All non-violent criminals jailed on minor drug offence should be released

#17

Post by lallysingh »

whiddershins wrote: post #2

First of all, I basically agree with this. Here’s something I don’t know: Sometimes I wonder whether some people in prison for non-violent drug offenses did a plea bargain down from a violent offense. And if that were the case, should this affect our opinion on any of this?

Fear holds justice back.

Re: Study: All non-violent criminals jailed on minor drug offence should be released

#19

Post by rwmurrayVT »

throwaway0a5e wrote: post #8
pmiller2 wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What would you consider a "violent drug offense"? Or, am I misreading your question?

It's easy to see how pistol whipping someone over a bad drug deal could be plead down to a non-violent possession/dealing offense because proving assault and battery is hard when the prosecution only has testimony and circumstantial evidence the prosecution's star witness is an addict with a mile long record. Possession is very easy to prove. A&B, DV, etc, etc are much harder to prosecute (and by "much" I mean "some…

The original charges are always shown in the judicial record even if they are later dropped from prosecution.

Re: Study: All non-violent criminals jailed on minor drug offence should be released

#20

Post by i_love_limes »

oytis wrote: post #5

A study (if it's a real study) can't tell you what should be done, it should give you new knowledge about the state of affairs. (while I agree that drug offense should be decriminalized).

Ehhh, most studies in this realm have a 'results' section and 'discussion' section. I disagree that experts in their field can't have an opinion laid out in the discussion section, given that it follows from the analysis and results from the previous sections.

That being said, the page is currently timing out, so I can' even read the article...

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