Being fired for this sort of thing sucks.
This also sounds like an opportunity for an awesome person to spread their wings now they're out from under what sounds like a pretty oppressive system
AI researcher Timnit Gebru resigns from Google
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Re: AI researcher Timnit Gebru resigns from Google
#12If I understand the document correctly, she wants HR to be biased against hiring "privileged" people (I think that means white, possibly male too, not sure) and wants to get politicians to force the company to report to create pressure for the same.
Re: AI researcher Timnit Gebru resigns from Google
#13Chief AI Scientist at Facebook, Yann Lecun, quit Twitter after a back and forth with this particular AI researcher - https://syncedreview.com/2020/06/30/yann-lecun-quits-twitter...
>I’m always amazed at how people can continue to do thing after thing like this and then turn around and ask me for some sort of extra DEI work or input. This happened to me last year. I was in the middle of a potential lawsuit for which Kat Herller and I hired feminist lawyers who threatened to sue Google (which is when they backed off--before that Google lawyers were prepared to throw us under the bus and our leaders were following as instructed) and the next day I get some random “impact award.” Pure gaslighting.
I think if you threaten to sue your employer, the employer isn't too much at fault and just covering their own neck when you later threaten to resign and they take you up on that offer.
Re: AI researcher Timnit Gebru resigns from Google
#14> And you are told after a while, that your manager can read you a privileged and confidential document and you’re not supposed to even know who contributed to this document, who wrote this feedback, what process was followed or anything Interesting. Having been on the receiving end of a (later proven to be bogus) HR complaint, this is exactly how it was handled. I was forced to respond to allegations where neither t…
That's how it is supposed to work. If you complain to HR about your manager how can they reveal your identity when your manager controls your performance review and compensation?
Which doesn't seem to be what was happening here though, or at least there's no indication to that effect.
At the same time, the narrative that someone above her in the management hierarchy decided to pull her research seems more plausible. In that case, I would tend to "Privacy for the Weak, Transparency for the Powerful." What you describe is the former, but this would seem to be a case of the latter.
Re: AI researcher Timnit Gebru resigns from Google
#15Corporations and their managers care only about making money and maintaining good vibes to produce a positive business environment. Only unions engaging in strikes and outside pressure can force them to change materially. All these internal committees and such are just PR. By the way, that part about unions and strikes also applies to the joined at the hip government as well.
Unions have historically been some of the most racist and discriminatory organizations in the USA.
> Unions have historically been some of the most racist and discriminatory organizations in the USA.
The USA has been pretty racist in discriminatory, and I think it's disingenuous to single out unions for that history. I mean, who instituted Jim Crow and profited from slavery? White voters, government officials, and private enterprise. Unions were definitely not leading that.
Re: AI researcher Timnit Gebru resigns from Google
#16This isn't the email that she sent with conditions she wanted met. Apparently she said she would resign if those conditions were not met, and the response to that email is that she was fired.
Re: AI researcher Timnit Gebru resigns from Google
#17Corporations and their managers care only about making money and maintaining good vibes to produce a positive business environment. Only unions engaging in strikes and outside pressure can force them to change materially. All these internal committees and such are just PR. By the way, that part about unions and strikes also applies to the joined at the hip government as well.
Unions have historically been some of the most racist and discriminatory organizations in the USA.
That's a crazy idea. There are sometimes unions that have racist members, and sometimes unions that are no good, but anyone paying attention to history has seen that unions are what fight for progressive change - material change that improves the lives of workers, who have always been multi-racial. Often they tackle racist structural problems. For example, in the Sanitation Workers' strike.
https://kinginstitute.stanford.edu/encyclopedia/memphis-sani...
Re: AI researcher Timnit Gebru resigns from Google
#18Corporations and their managers care only about making money and maintaining good vibes to produce a positive business environment. Only unions engaging in strikes and outside pressure can force them to change materially. All these internal committees and such are just PR. By the way, that part about unions and strikes also applies to the joined at the hip government as well.
Unions have historically been some of the most racist and discriminatory organizations in the USA.
This is so unhelpful and dumb. The US has historically been one of the most racist and discriminatory organizations in North America. Does that mean we shouldn’t engage the US? Does that mean the US can’t be less racist? Does that mean the US isn’t a tool we can try to use to make the world a better place?
Unions provide countervailing power to corporate power. Racist people are racist. Sometimes these can overlap.
Re: AI researcher Timnit Gebru resigns from Google
#19I think this is actually the better link to be discussing, rather than the twitter threads shared before. The most relevant parts (in terms of back story) should be this: > A week before you go out on vacation, you see a meeting pop up at 4:30pm PST on your calendar (this popped up at around 2pm). No one would tell you what the meeting was about in advance. Then in that meeting your manager’s manager tells you “it ha…
I really want to read that paper. Can't wait til it's published. Presuming it'll be at FAccT*...
Re: AI researcher Timnit Gebru resigns from Google
#20> And you are told after a while, that your manager can read you a privileged and confidential document and you’re not supposed to even know who contributed to this document, who wrote this feedback, what process was followed or anything Interesting. Having been on the receiving end of a (later proven to be bogus) HR complaint, this is exactly how it was handled. I was forced to respond to allegations where neither t…
That's how it is supposed to work. If you complain to HR about your manager how can they reveal your identity when your manager controls your performance review and compensation?
Oh, I agree, I just found it interesting that the AI Researcher's case was treated the same way. It makes me wonder if the issue was really feedback about the paper and not some other HR complaint.
>That's how it is supposed to work. The thing that sucked about it was that it was impossible to defend myself. I only found out details after the fact because the complaint was anonymously filed on behalf of a co-worker and it was the co-worker that later came to me to explain.