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Pippi and the Moomins

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Re: Pippi and the Moomins

#11

Post by sireat »

zajio1am wrote: post #6
dmitriid wrote: post #5

There's a similar author in Russia, Nikolai Nosov [1] He wrote most heart-warming stories for children or about children during WWII. If you read Russian, here's a great article about him: [2] --- quote, Google translate --- And the truth is that Nosov began writing stories shortly before the war (the first publication was in 1938), but the most famous, the brightest and most memorable were written in the most terrib…

> There's a similar author in Russia, Nikolai Nosov [1] It is worth noting that he alse wrote Dunno on the Moon - hardcore communist propaganda for children.

Dunno and His friends is sort of naturalistic kids book.

Dunno in the Sun City is the communist propaganda promoting a statist view.(the anti-hooligan bits). Lots of cool tech will solve everything. Self-driving cars.

Dunno on the Moon is a biting satire of free market.

Some of the bits are still relevant.

-The big seed startup that Dunno creates with the shady partners.

-The stock market schemes on the barge.

-The pay for everything(key,blanket,tv etc) business model hotel.

-The police corruption.

-The collusion at the highest level.

-The dog walker profession. (the walker's condition is markedly worse than the dogs they care for

- the role of mass media

-The salt startup and the salt market dumping and crash.

Re: Pippi and the Moomins

#12

Post by sireat »

dmitriid wrote: post #10
zajio1am wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There's a similar author in Russia, Nikolai Nosov [1] It is worth noting that he alse wrote Dunno on the Moon - hardcore communist propaganda for children.

It's hardly hardcore communist propaganda. It's some of his best work. It is anticapitalist propaganda, for sure, but hardly hardcore communist propaganda, and is very prescient of many issues (well, hard to be prescient about something that was always the case). Moreover, Dunno on the Moon uses concepts and ideas that a person in the USSR would have no to little idea about (e.g. stock markets, negative campaigning e…

Exactly, Nosov took the worst bits of capitalism and made a quite accurate potrayal of those bits.

Re: Pippi and the Moomins

#13

Post by krstffr »

sorokod wrote: post #3

I remember rereading Pippi to my son and marveling at how authority subversive it was.

It is also absolutley filled with the n-word (at least my Swedish edition from the 90's), which always makes for an interesting challenge having to censor and come up with alternative words as you go.

Re: Pippi and the Moomins

#14

Post by macspoofing »

Both are tremendous works. I grew up on Swedish literature. Very fond memories of the entire 'Bullerby' series.

>The antics in postwar Nordic children’s books left propaganda and prudery behind. We need this madcap spirit more than ever

True words especially in the middle of our moral panic.

Re: Pippi and the Moomins

#15

Post by twic »

goto11 wrote: post #8
andi999 wrote: post #7

I find the subtitle is weird (at least for the Pippi part):'left propaganda and prudery behind.'. Prudery in my understand mostly refers to a person 'being more uncomfortable than most with sexuality or nudity.'. Maybe it is used in a different sense here, but the Pippi book do not take any position on sexuality or nudity (like Disney in movies, parents are absent (father later joins in)).

Prudery is not specifically about sexuality but more generally being overly concerned about "manners" and "proper behavior", something Pippi completely disregards.

I'm a native English speaker, and i understand "prude" to be mostly related to sex.

Re: Pippi and the Moomins

#16

Post by DanBC »

krstffr wrote: post #13
sorokod wrote: post #3

I remember rereading Pippi to my son and marveling at how authority subversive it was.

It is also absolutley filled with the n-word (at least my Swedish edition from the 90's), which always makes for an interesting challenge having to censor and come up with alternative words as you go.

I found this, where a parent edits out the word in an audioplay version: https://koneensaatio.fi/en/when-pippi-said-the-n-word/

> I mentioned the situation later to a colleague, who said that the same problem had come up in the family, but they had tackled it with a practical solution. Working with sound, this colleague processed the audiobook with editing software to find out whether the N-words could be cut out smoothly. That being done successfully, the children could then listen to the edited version. The problem was solved.

I like this part:

> “For my daughter, Pippi is a really empowering character, so I can’t just not read the book, because censorship would only make her more interested. So I edit the text while reading it,” he says.

Re: Pippi and the Moomins

#17

Post by sorokod »

krstffr wrote: post #13
sorokod wrote: post #3

I remember rereading Pippi to my son and marveling at how authority subversive it was.

It is also absolutley filled with the n-word (at least my Swedish edition from the 90's), which always makes for an interesting challenge having to censor and come up with alternative words as you go.

Is that about Pippi's father being a king of the natives?

Re: Pippi and the Moomins

#18

Post by DanBC »

twic wrote: post #15
goto11 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Prudery is not specifically about sexuality but more generally being overly concerned about "manners" and "proper behavior", something Pippi completely disregards.

I'm a native English speaker, and i understand "prude" to be mostly related to sex.

Yes, that's how it's mostly used today. But here are some dictionary definitions.

OED (I've cut the examples)

> prude, a. and n.

> A. adj. That maintains or affects extreme propriety of speech and behaviour, especially in regard to the relations of the sexes; excessively modest, demure, or prim; prudish: usually applied adversely. Now rare.

[...]

> prude, a. and n.

> (pruːd)[a. mod.F. prude adj. and n., said of a woman in same sense as the Eng. (Molière in Littré), in OF. prude, prode, preude, in a laudatory sense, good, virtuous, modest, respectable; either a back-formation from prudefemme (cf. prudhomme) or a later fem. form of prod, pro, pru: see preux, prow a.]

>prude, a. and n.

> B. n. A woman who maintains or affects excessive modesty or propriety in conduct or speech; one who is of extreme propriety: usually applied adversely with implication of affectation.

[...]

> prude, a. and n.

> Hence ˈprudelike a., of the nature of, or characteristic of, a prude; ˈprudely adv., in the manner of a prude.

[...]

> prude, v.

> intr. To conduct oneself in the manner of a prude; to act prudishly. Hence ˈpruding vbl. n.

Websters Revised (1913):

> Prude \Prude\, n. [F., prudish, originally, discreet, modest;

> shortened from OF. prudefeme, preudefeme, a discreet or excellent woman; OF. preu, prou, excellent, brave + de of + fete woman. See {Prow}, a., {Prowess}.] A woman of affected modesty, reserve, or coyness; one who is overscrupulous or sensitive; one who affects extraordinary prudence in conduct and speech.

Chambers:

> prude /prood/

> noun

> 1. A person of priggish or affected modesty

> 2. Someone who has or pretends to have extreme propriety

> adjective ( rare)

> 1. Priggish or affectedly modest

> 2. Claiming extreme propriety

Re: Pippi and the Moomins

#19

Post by zajio1am »

sireat wrote: post #12
dmitriid wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's hardly hardcore communist propaganda. It's some of his best work. It is anticapitalist propaganda, for sure, but hardly hardcore communist propaganda, and is very prescient of many issues (well, hard to be prescient about something that was always the case). Moreover, Dunno on the Moon uses concepts and ideas that a person in the USSR would have no to little idea about (e.g. stock markets, negative campaigning e…

Exactly, Nosov took the worst bits of capitalism and made a quite accurate potrayal of those bits.

If you just show worst bits of one side, make them define the side as a whole, and then show idealized version of the other side, that is pretty much propaganda, even if these worst bits are described accurately.

Re: Pippi and the Moomins

#20

Post by rypskar »

“I have never tried that before, so I think I should definitely be able to do that.” ― Astrid Lindgren, Pippi Longstocking

One of my favorite quotes, such a great way to look at life

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