Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Adolphe Sax, Inventor of the Saxophone

dinant.be

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

11–20 of 41 posts

Re: Adolphe Sax, Inventor of the Saxophone

#11

Post by jacquesm »

zoomablemind wrote: post #10
jojobas wrote: post #4

Fun fact: a cone open on one end (saxophone) supports all harmonics, as does a cylinder open on both ends (flute). A cylinder open on one end (clarinet) only supports odd harmonics, which is why a clarinet sounds "rounded" and overblows into a twelfth, rather than an octave (as on former two).

Interesting observation is that sax having a conical bore and using a reed to induce the sound resembles an oboe. Indeed, the fingering is nearly the same. Yet, the brass resonates in a much brighter and louder way. The reed and the mouthpiece are of clarinet design, except of conical kind. A true hybrid, ingenious synthesis. Oboe's sound is pliable, thanks to the double reed, player's embouchure, and the richer spec…

Oboe is quite a neat instrument though:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2WJhax7Jmxs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vE2O_yfgtBU

Re: Adolphe Sax, Inventor of the Saxophone

#12

Post by throwaway_pdp09 »

jacquesm wrote: post #7

Also, note that technically a Saxophone is a woodwind , not brass. I played the saxophone for half my life and it is still my favorite instrument sound wise, even though I can no longer play it due to a lung issue. Also, it is quite close to the human voice which makes it very nice to interact with singing voices. Fantastic invention, and modern music really would not be the same without it. Try the solos in Baker St…

A question please, "and it is still my favorite instrument sound wise". Can the sax in general be said to have one sound? I knew 2 sax players at school, their instruments were much the same in size and appearance, excepting a little ornamentation on one. One was very smooth, it was a great sound. The other was much harsher, almost braying[0]. They seemed to be played with much the same high level of skill, so why the difference? They both sounded like saxes but...

[0] edit; certainly in tune but quite harsh, rough as a terrier's coat

Re: Adolphe Sax, Inventor of the Saxophone

#13

Post by sacado2 »

throwaway_pdp09 wrote: post #12
jacquesm wrote: post #7

Also, note that technically a Saxophone is a woodwind , not brass. I played the saxophone for half my life and it is still my favorite instrument sound wise, even though I can no longer play it due to a lung issue. Also, it is quite close to the human voice which makes it very nice to interact with singing voices. Fantastic invention, and modern music really would not be the same without it. Try the solos in Baker St…

A question please, "and it is still my favorite instrument sound wise". Can the sax in general be said to have one sound? I knew 2 sax players at school, their instruments were much the same in size and appearance, excepting a little ornamentation on one. One was very smooth, it was a great sound. The other was much harsher, almost braying[0]. They seemed to be played with much the same high level of skill, so why th…

It's all about technique and the style you want to develop. Two singers can have very different voices too.

Re: Adolphe Sax, Inventor of the Saxophone

#14

Post by jacquesm »

throwaway_pdp09 wrote: post #12
jacquesm wrote: post #7

Also, note that technically a Saxophone is a woodwind , not brass. I played the saxophone for half my life and it is still my favorite instrument sound wise, even though I can no longer play it due to a lung issue. Also, it is quite close to the human voice which makes it very nice to interact with singing voices. Fantastic invention, and modern music really would not be the same without it. Try the solos in Baker St…

A question please, "and it is still my favorite instrument sound wise". Can the sax in general be said to have one sound? I knew 2 sax players at school, their instruments were much the same in size and appearance, excepting a little ornamentation on one. One was very smooth, it was a great sound. The other was much harsher, almost braying[0]. They seemed to be played with much the same high level of skill, so why th…

That's a good point, you can actually change the way a sax sounds quite strongly, there are even people who modify their reeds. The difference between the way the same instrument family sounds on say Pink Floyd's "Dark side of the moon" (Dick Parry) sounds versus say Brandford Marsalis, Michael Brecker, Fela Kuti, Grover Washington or (god forbid) Kenny G is huge.

Of course 'saxophone' is a whole range of instruments going from Low-E giants to saxes so small you have to have pretty small fingers to not hit two valves at the same time.

The mouthpiece and the reed thickness are a big factor in this as is air pressure, 'tonguing' the reed and how you shape your mouth cavity. Endless variation.

But the basic harmonics are baked into the instrument, those would be very hard to change though I'm sure it is possible to manipulate which ones get amplified by the above changes to the environment.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kZjZBe6o78M

Is a nice example, it would be a pretty boring song without that raging saxophone.

Re: Adolphe Sax, Inventor of the Saxophone

#15

Post by throwaway_pdp09 »

jacquesm wrote: post #14
throwaway_pdp09 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A question please, "and it is still my favorite instrument sound wise". Can the sax in general be said to have one sound? I knew 2 sax players at school, their instruments were much the same in size and appearance, excepting a little ornamentation on one. One was very smooth, it was a great sound. The other was much harsher, almost braying[0]. They seemed to be played with much the same high level of skill, so why th…

That's a good point, you can actually change the way a sax sounds quite strongly, there are even people who modify their reeds. The difference between the way the same instrument family sounds on say Pink Floyd's "Dark side of the moon" (Dick Parry) sounds versus say Brandford Marsalis, Michael Brecker, Fela Kuti, Grover Washington or (god forbid) Kenny G is huge. Of course 'saxophone' is a whole range of instruments…

> a whole range of instruments going from

I know but I simply didn't have the vocabulary to distinguish them by name or type, so emphasised their common size and appearance. Thanks for the comprhensive answer, and never even heard of Morphine, ta for that!

Re: Adolphe Sax, Inventor of the Saxophone

#16

Post by jojobas »

zoomablemind wrote: post #10
jojobas wrote: post #4

Fun fact: a cone open on one end (saxophone) supports all harmonics, as does a cylinder open on both ends (flute). A cylinder open on one end (clarinet) only supports odd harmonics, which is why a clarinet sounds "rounded" and overblows into a twelfth, rather than an octave (as on former two).

Interesting observation is that sax having a conical bore and using a reed to induce the sound resembles an oboe. Indeed, the fingering is nearly the same. Yet, the brass resonates in a much brighter and louder way. The reed and the mouthpiece are of clarinet design, except of conical kind. A true hybrid, ingenious synthesis. Oboe's sound is pliable, thanks to the double reed, player's embouchure, and the richer spec…

Soprano sax is not that easy to tell from an oboe.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_b-zbqcRick

There are differences of course, but I'd bet the majority of people couldn't tell most of the time.

Re: Adolphe Sax, Inventor of the Saxophone

#17

Post by jacquesm »

throwaway_pdp09 wrote: post #15
jacquesm wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a good point, you can actually change the way a sax sounds quite strongly, there are even people who modify their reeds. The difference between the way the same instrument family sounds on say Pink Floyd's "Dark side of the moon" (Dick Parry) sounds versus say Brandford Marsalis, Michael Brecker, Fela Kuti, Grover Washington or (god forbid) Kenny G is huge. Of course 'saxophone' is a whole range of instruments…

> a whole range of instruments going from I know but I simply didn't have the vocabulary to distinguish them by name or type, so emphasised their common size and appearance. Thanks for the comprhensive answer, and never even heard of Morphine, ta for that!

You're welcome. For some other really nice saxophone: Anything by Steps Ahead, Grover Washington's record 'mister magic'. If you want more drop me a line by email, I'll do some digging in my collection.

To give an idea of the range of saxophones:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sopranino_saxophone

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7XqwC1NmtG4

to

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subcontrabass_saxophone

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kgt2m9Q7Kz0

Re: Adolphe Sax, Inventor of the Saxophone

#18

Post by jacquesm »

jojobas wrote: post #16
zoomablemind wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting observation is that sax having a conical bore and using a reed to induce the sound resembles an oboe. Indeed, the fingering is nearly the same. Yet, the brass resonates in a much brighter and louder way. The reed and the mouthpiece are of clarinet design, except of conical kind. A true hybrid, ingenious synthesis. Oboe's sound is pliable, thanks to the double reed, player's embouchure, and the richer spec…

Soprano sax is not that easy to tell from an oboe. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_b-zbqcRick There are differences of course, but I'd bet the majority of people couldn't tell most of the time.

Beautiful! I can easily tell the difference but that's cheating (after playing the sax of 17 years or so), the sax sounds a bit sharper and the oboe 'rounder' if that makes any sense, which makes it easy to pick out what is played by which instrument. Originally this piece is for two oboes, but this is a really nice variation and lovely to see a saxophone used for more traditional music, I wished more people would do that (but saxes are typically frowned upon for performing classical works in a 'serious' setting).

Re: Adolphe Sax, Inventor of the Saxophone

#19

Post by samplenoise »

jojobas wrote: post #4

Fun fact: a cone open on one end (saxophone) supports all harmonics, as does a cylinder open on both ends (flute). A cylinder open on one end (clarinet) only supports odd harmonics, which is why a clarinet sounds "rounded" and overblows into a twelfth, rather than an octave (as on former two).

Which is also why saxophones can be made to sound like an organ (one open end)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TmFlxwvKLz4&gl=BE

Re: Adolphe Sax, Inventor of the Saxophone

#20

Post by jacquesm »

samplenoise wrote: post #19
jojobas wrote: post #4

Fun fact: a cone open on one end (saxophone) supports all harmonics, as does a cylinder open on both ends (flute). A cylinder open on one end (clarinet) only supports odd harmonics, which is why a clarinet sounds "rounded" and overblows into a twelfth, rather than an octave (as on former two).

Which is also why saxophones can be made to sound like an organ (one open end) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TmFlxwvKLz4&gl=BE

That's very beautiful, wow, thank you for posting this.

For a lark I once played organ pipes of an organ that was being decommissioned. It is absolutely incredible how much air that requires, a 8' pipe I could just about get to resonate, and once they resonate it becomes a lot easier because you have some backpressure but that initial rush to get the reed to move at all is quite literally breathtaking.

Post reply on HN