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China sharply expands mass labor program in Tibet

reuters.com

11–20 of 456 posts

Re: China sharply expands mass labor program in Tibet

#11

What China has done to Tibet is horrible. One thing that is missing from this article is how they are doing this? How are they coercing people? Are they literally dragging them out of their homes? Threatening them? Or are they just offering them opportunities that are actually preferable to their current conditions, and the people are accepting them?

The article says they are pushing them off the land and into factory jobs, so that implies to me that they don't want to leave, otherwise they wouldn't have to "push" them.

Re: China sharply expands mass labor program in Tibet

#12
post #4

> A notice posted to the website of Tibet’s regional government website last month said over half a million people were trained as part of the project in the first seven months of 2020 - around 15% of the region’s population. Of this total, almost 50,000 have been transferred into jobs within Tibet, and several thousand have been sent to other parts of China. Many end up in low paid work, including textile manufactur…

There isn't just one type of oppression, so saying stuff like "actual" oppression does nothing but to disparage other types of oppression.

Re: China sharply expands mass labor program in Tibet

#13
post #8
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this a genuine question? I don’t want to be snarky, but you are aware of the fact that government-imposed “mass labour” has almost always meant “forced labor” (I’m sure there might be some punctual exceptions, but the conclusion is the same), no?

Is Roosevelts New Deal 'forced labor'?

> The government documents reviewed by Reuters put a strong emphasis on ideological education to correct the “thinking concepts” of laborers. “There is the assertion that minorities are low in discipline, that their minds must be changed, that they must be convinced to participate,” said Zenz, the Tibet-Xinjiang researcher based in Minnesota.

> One policy document, posted on the website of the Nagqu City government in Tibet’s east in December 2018, reveals early goals for the plan and sheds light on the approach. It describes how officials visited villages to collect data on 57,800 laborers. Their aim was to tackle “can’t do, don’t want to do and don’t dare to do” attitudes toward work, the document says. It calls for unspecified measures to “effectively eliminate ‘lazy people.’”

I don't remember the bit in history class where Roosevelt discussed forceful re-education.

Re: China sharply expands mass labor program in Tibet

#14
post #11

What China has done to Tibet is horrible. One thing that is missing from this article is how they are doing this? How are they coercing people? Are they literally dragging them out of their homes? Threatening them? Or are they just offering them opportunities that are actually preferable to their current conditions, and the people are accepting them?

The article says they are pushing them off the land and into factory jobs, so that implies to me that they don't want to leave, otherwise they wouldn't have to "push" them.

Why would the author use the word "pushing" if they don't know how this is actually happening? And if they know how it is actually happening, why leave it out of the article?

Re: China sharply expands mass labor program in Tibet

#15
post #11

What China has done to Tibet is horrible. One thing that is missing from this article is how they are doing this? How are they coercing people? Are they literally dragging them out of their homes? Threatening them? Or are they just offering them opportunities that are actually preferable to their current conditions, and the people are accepting them?

The article says they are pushing them off the land and into factory jobs, so that implies to me that they don't want to leave, otherwise they wouldn't have to "push" them.

In short "push" means to use violence to force the will of otherwise non-compliant "dissenting" citizens.

It's disgusting and a stunning violation of human rights.

Re: China sharply expands mass labor program in Tibet

#16
post #11

What China has done to Tibet is horrible. One thing that is missing from this article is how they are doing this? How are they coercing people? Are they literally dragging them out of their homes? Threatening them? Or are they just offering them opportunities that are actually preferable to their current conditions, and the people are accepting them?

The article says they are pushing them off the land and into factory jobs, so that implies to me that they don't want to leave, otherwise they wouldn't have to "push" them.

[deleted]

Re: China sharply expands mass labor program in Tibet

#17
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is Roosevelts New Deal 'forced labor'?

> The government documents reviewed by Reuters put a strong emphasis on ideological education to correct the “thinking concepts” of laborers. “There is the assertion that minorities are low in discipline, that their minds must be changed, that they must be convinced to participate,” said Zenz, the Tibet-Xinjiang researcher based in Minnesota. > One policy document, posted on the website of the Nagqu City government i…

I don't think you'd want to whitewash Zenz as a Tibet-Xinjiang researcher when he is known to have said that he is on a religious mission against China.

https://thegrayzone.com/2019/12/21/china-detaining-millions-...

Re: China sharply expands mass labor program in Tibet

#18
post #10

Han supremacy has all the markings of other supremacist movements and will unfortunately need to be confronted. Not sure when the world will work up the courage to do so, though.

Not until China stops manufacturing everything, and I'm thinking by then it will be too late.

Re: China sharply expands mass labor program in Tibet

#19
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The government documents reviewed by Reuters put a strong emphasis on ideological education to correct the “thinking concepts” of laborers. “There is the assertion that minorities are low in discipline, that their minds must be changed, that they must be convinced to participate,” said Zenz, the Tibet-Xinjiang researcher based in Minnesota. > One policy document, posted on the website of the Nagqu City government i…

I don't think you'd want to whitewash Zenz as a Tibet-Xinjiang researcher when he is known to have said that he is on a religious mission against China. https://thegrayzone.com/2019/12/21/china-detaining-millions-...

[deleted]

Re: China sharply expands mass labor program in Tibet

#20

What China has done to Tibet is horrible. One thing that is missing from this article is how they are doing this? How are they coercing people? Are they literally dragging them out of their homes? Threatening them? Or are they just offering them opportunities that are actually preferable to their current conditions, and the people are accepting them?

I've hiked through regions of Tibet and talked to villagers in relatively remote areas. One thing I saw hiking in the mountains and valleys was abandoned nomad lodges and pastures. My Tibetan guide sadly explained to me that the local officials found the nomads too hard to manage when they were living independently and so used a system of sticks and carrots (fines and subsidies) to move them into villages that were created from scratch and comprised of cookie-cutter cement houses.

One effective incentive to get the nomads to settle down is to threaten their family members with fines or removal of subsidies unless they move into town.

I visited some of those made-ex-nihilo villages and talked to the people there. One immediately obvious thing is there are Chinese national flags flying on almost every single household and big posters of Xi in the households. I asked about those and the residents explained they get fined if they don't fly the flag or hang Xi's photo. They were definitely not acting out of patriotism. The scenes reminded me of a wartime occupation.

Military recruitment posters were also plastered everywhere, as it is a form of employment in a region with relatively few alternatives.

This is the first time I've heard of migration ratios as bureaucratic targets, but it's not surprising at all as it is typical for the government to set clear KPIs for their policies.

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