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How well do cars do in crash tests they're not optimized for?

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Re: How well do cars do in crash tests they're not optimized for?

#11

Post by nradov »

laegooose wrote: post #5

The whole car safety topic is very confusing. Car accidents is top1-top2 death reason in US for people in 20-40 age group [1]. Probably less in Europe but still one of the leading ones. I was thinking about how I can make myself safer. Which car brand/model is better? Which seat is better for passenger? How much riskier it is to drive during the night? In the rain? How dangerous is it to overtake on road with 1 lane…

The most relevant research on car brands and models is probably the IIHS driver death rate data. It's not perfect since the populations are self selecting (cars aren't assigned to drivers at random) but within a particular vehicle class if you see a huge difference in death rates then that's probably meaningful.

https://www.iihs.org/ratings/driver-death-rates-by-make-and-...

Re: How well do cars do in crash tests they're not optimized for?

#12

Post by dublinben »

laegooose wrote: post #5

The whole car safety topic is very confusing. Car accidents is top1-top2 death reason in US for people in 20-40 age group [1]. Probably less in Europe but still one of the leading ones. I was thinking about how I can make myself safer. Which car brand/model is better? Which seat is better for passenger? How much riskier it is to drive during the night? In the rain? How dangerous is it to overtake on road with 1 lane…

You're right that there aren't meaningfully significant differences between car brands. Driving itself is just very dangerous. Other forms of transportation like buses, trains, and airplanes are orders of magnitude safer.[0] If you want to make yourself safer, avoid driving as much as possible.

[0] https://injuryfacts.nsc.org/home-and-community/safety-topics...

Re: How well do cars do in crash tests they're not optimized for?

#13

Post by Someone »

andrewzah wrote: post #8
amelius wrote: post #7

How about F1 cars?

Has there ever been a full or partial head-on collision with an f1 car?

My guess would be one car spinning 180 degrees and another one hitting it must have happened, even with the spinned car at rest and the other one at high speed, but two cars moving at speed in reverse directions? Unlikely.

Re: How well do cars do in crash tests they're not optimized for?

#15

Post by michaelt »

czzr wrote: post #2

Optimizing for a test is an issue if the test is not well correlated with the desired outcome. By and large that doesn’t seem to be a big issue for crash tests.

In this case, it's an argument that crash testing should be more expansive and thorough.

For example, if engineers are going to position the driver and passenger airbags for optimal crash test performance, we probably shouldn't just be testing with a male dummy in the driver's seat and a female dummy in the passenger's seat, as in the modern age women often drive.

If engineers are strictly designing to the test, there should be a suite of repeats, putting dummies that are male, female, fat, thin, tall and short in every seat.

Re: How well do cars do in crash tests they're not optimized for?

#16

Post by DerpyBaby123 »

czzr wrote: post #2

Optimizing for a test is an issue if the test is not well correlated with the desired outcome. By and large that doesn’t seem to be a big issue for crash tests.

>By and large that doesn’t seem to be a big issue for crash tests.

Source? The article provides data as a counterpoint:

>Check to see if crash tests are being gamed with hyper-specific optimization looking at what happens when new tests are added since that lets us see a crash test result that manufacturers weren't optimizing for just to get a good score

Re: How well do cars do in crash tests they're not optimized for?

#17

Post by JoeAltmaier »

laegooose wrote: post #5

The whole car safety topic is very confusing. Car accidents is top1-top2 death reason in US for people in 20-40 age group [1]. Probably less in Europe but still one of the leading ones. I was thinking about how I can make myself safer. Which car brand/model is better? Which seat is better for passenger? How much riskier it is to drive during the night? In the rain? How dangerous is it to overtake on road with 1 lane…

Drive the largest vehicle you can. When in a collision the momentum is converted to crushing force, you want to be in the less-crushable vehicle.

Hey this may be an unpopular choice, but it is the one with the biggest safety impact! And that was the question.

Re: How well do cars do in crash tests they're not optimized for?

#18

Post by bryanmgreen »

andrewzah wrote: post #8
amelius wrote: post #7

How about F1 cars?

Has there ever been a full or partial head-on collision with an f1 car?

They’ve been T-Boned in modern times and although not exactly a head on collision with another vehicle, they do crash at high 100+ MPH straight into barriers with very limited injuries.

Re: How well do cars do in crash tests they're not optimized for?

#19

Post by kcolford »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #17
laegooose wrote: post #5

The whole car safety topic is very confusing. Car accidents is top1-top2 death reason in US for people in 20-40 age group [1]. Probably less in Europe but still one of the leading ones. I was thinking about how I can make myself safer. Which car brand/model is better? Which seat is better for passenger? How much riskier it is to drive during the night? In the rain? How dangerous is it to overtake on road with 1 lane…

Drive the largest vehicle you can. When in a collision the momentum is converted to crushing force, you want to be in the less-crushable vehicle. Hey this may be an unpopular choice, but it is the one with the biggest safety impact! And that was the question.

Correction: you want to be in the vehicle with the most crushable distance of material. That way the force is spread out more over time and there's less going through your body at any moment.

Re: How well do cars do in crash tests they're not optimized for?

#20

Post by anonymoushn »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #17
laegooose wrote: post #5

The whole car safety topic is very confusing. Car accidents is top1-top2 death reason in US for people in 20-40 age group [1]. Probably less in Europe but still one of the leading ones. I was thinking about how I can make myself safer. Which car brand/model is better? Which seat is better for passenger? How much riskier it is to drive during the night? In the rain? How dangerous is it to overtake on road with 1 lane…

Drive the largest vehicle you can. When in a collision the momentum is converted to crushing force, you want to be in the less-crushable vehicle. Hey this may be an unpopular choice, but it is the one with the biggest safety impact! And that was the question.

if you defect you get a bigger payoff than if you cooperate!
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