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"Amazon's EBSs are a barrel of laughs in terms of performance and reliability"

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11–20 of 157 posts

Re: "Amazon's EBSs are a barrel of laughs in terms of performance and reliability"

#11

Why is reddit relying on only one cloud provider? AWS can/should do better but service providers of the size of reddit should be using mult-vendor set-ups for sure.

They did say in their original post-mortem that spreading the load among multiple availability zones has been on their todo list for a while. It has just taken longer than they expected with their limited engineering staff.

Re: "Amazon's EBSs are a barrel of laughs in terms of performance and reliability"

#12
Never fails: a cloud provider has issues with a specific cloud product, so clearly the cloud is an illusion that will crash down on you[1]. Any discussion about any cloud provider's product is obviously a chance to soapbox about the industry as a whole.

[1]: http://www.reddit.com/r/blog/comments/g66f0/why_reddit_was_d...

Re: "Amazon's EBSs are a barrel of laughs in terms of performance and reliability"

#13
post #9

Why is reddit relying on only one cloud provider? AWS can/should do better but service providers of the size of reddit should be using mult-vendor set-ups for sure.

It probably has something to do with the group being very small. Sure they turn a lot of traffic, but there's only so much you can do with a group of their size on what I imagine is still a limited budget.

Sounds like a case of similar to safety systems at a nuclear plant. Not pressing until it is REALLY PRESSING! Its the usual dilemma, investing time/moey on something that most likely wont be needed versus adding that cool feature all the users will immediately see the benefit of. In a competitive environment, it isn't difficult to understand how they ended up on one vendor.

Re: "Amazon's EBSs are a barrel of laughs in terms of performance and reliability"

#14

This comment further down, supposedly from an Amazon employee, paints a grim picture for EBS: http://www.reddit.com/r/blog/comments/g66f0/why_reddit_was_d...

The perspectives of disgruntled employees have been known to be worse than reality, on occasion. Not definitively saying that's the case here, just saying.

Re: "Amazon's EBSs are a barrel of laughs in terms of performance and reliability"

#15
post #13
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It probably has something to do with the group being very small. Sure they turn a lot of traffic, but there's only so much you can do with a group of their size on what I imagine is still a limited budget.

Sounds like a case of similar to safety systems at a nuclear plant. Not pressing until it is REALLY PRESSING! Its the usual dilemma, investing time/moey on something that most likely wont be needed versus adding that cool feature all the users will immediately see the benefit of. In a competitive environment, it isn't difficult to understand how they ended up on one vendor.

If a nuclear plant has problems, it can kill a lot of people, and wreck the lives of many others.

If reddit has problems, I suppose the worst that can happen is a cloud of toxic and poorly thought out comments is released on the internet.

So the tradeoffs they've made, in saving some money, are probably sensible.

Re: "Amazon's EBSs are a barrel of laughs in terms of performance and reliability"

#16
post #3

The AWS business model is to sell shared hosting on commodity hardware. Cloud is a cool buzzword but it is still sharing hardware. Cheap, commodity hardware is the magic that lets you scale up so big and so fast for a highly accessible price. But you're still sharing the same hardware as everyone else and its still just commodity hardware.

For what it's worth, it's not entirely accurate to say that you are always using shared hardware on AWS, at least for your servers. It depends on how you set up your environment.

Re: "Amazon's EBSs are a barrel of laughs in terms of performance and reliability"

#17

Never fails: a cloud provider has issues with a specific cloud product, so clearly the cloud is an illusion that will crash down on you[1]. Any discussion about any cloud provider's product is obviously a chance to soapbox about the industry as a whole. [1]: http://www.reddit.com/r/blog/comments/g66f0/why_reddit_was_d...

In the minds of many people, Amazon is the most well known, and respected cloud provider. Their outage is merely a reminder that the one big difference between cloud services and in-house services is, I can't control it. Of course the probability that Amazon will have better uptime than you is pretty high for most people, but you have no recourse when there is a problem.

Re: "Amazon's EBSs are a barrel of laughs in terms of performance and reliability"

#18
I love the idea behind EBS, a SAN makes life so much easier, but I too find that EBS glitches are the largest cause of unreliability in AWS.

I'm not immediately planning to move out of AWS, but the trouble with EBS has certainly got me thinking about other options and has made me much less inclined to make an increased commitment to AWS.

Re: "Amazon's EBSs are a barrel of laughs in terms of performance and reliability"

#19
Generally speaking this is the sort of thing that people warn about when they say "if you want to run on a cloud, you need to design your application for a cloud". Meaning, you can't presume your infrastructure is dedicated and carries similar MTBFs of (say) an enterprise hard drive, which upwards of 1 million hours.

Amazon provides plenty of opportunities to mitigate for this, such as providing multiple availability zones. Reddit, if you read the original blog post, wasn't designed for that - it was designed for a single data centre.

OTOH, the variability of EBS performance is true, and frustrating. If you do a RAID0 stripe across 4 drives, you can expect around sustained 100 MB/sec in performance modulo hiccups that can bring it down by a factor of 5. On a compute cluster instance (cc1.4xlarge) it's more like up to 300 MB/sec if you go up to 8 drives, since they provision more network bandwidth and seem to be able to cordon it off better with a placement group.

Re: "Amazon's EBSs are a barrel of laughs in terms of performance and reliability"

#20

I love the idea behind EBS, a SAN makes life so much easier, but I too find that EBS glitches are the largest cause of unreliability in AWS. I'm not immediately planning to move out of AWS, but the trouble with EBS has certainly got me thinking about other options and has made me much less inclined to make an increased commitment to AWS.

EBS is not a SAN which is largely the point being made in these comments and in the other HN article on reddit's post mortem.
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